What creates wisdom?

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trismegisto
 
Reply Tue 6 Apr, 2010 08:53 pm
@north,
north;149029 wrote:
what creates wisdom ( or better discovers wisdom ) is curiosity and the want to know


How about tempered curiosity and the want to know?
 
north
 
Reply Tue 6 Apr, 2010 09:31 pm
@trismegisto,
trismegisto;149044 wrote:
How about tempered curiosity and the want to know?


why tempered curiosity ?
 
Fido
 
Reply Tue 6 Apr, 2010 09:39 pm
@north,
north;149029 wrote:
what creates wisdom ( or better discovers wisdom ) is curiosity and the want to know

Ones desire is another's addiction...

---------- Post added 04-06-2010 at 11:41 PM ----------

north;149051 wrote:
why tempered curiosity ?



I have had my curiosity tempted, but never tempered, nor tamed.
 
trismegisto
 
Reply Tue 6 Apr, 2010 09:42 pm
@north,
north;149051 wrote:
why tempered curiosity ?


Only because the curious mind that stands in front of a train to see if it can stop in time is not very wise.

Everything in moderation.
 
north
 
Reply Tue 6 Apr, 2010 09:47 pm
@Fido,
Fido;149055 wrote:
Ones desire is another's addiction...


not wise then



---------- Post added 04-06-2010 at 11:41 PM ----------




Quote:
I have had my curiosity tempted, but never tempered, nor tamed.


then we should include imagination > hence the understanding of the consequences of.....
 
Fido
 
Reply Tue 6 Apr, 2010 09:56 pm
@Karpowich,
Wisdom is another danged infinite... Give up defining it, and try to be it...
 
north
 
Reply Tue 6 Apr, 2010 10:10 pm
@Fido,
Fido;149066 wrote:
Wisdom is another danged infinite...


not in what creates it , just what constitutes wisdom

Quote:
Give up defining it, and try to be it...


and then what is wisdom ?

without defining wisdom , how does one " try to be it " ?
 
Fido
 
Reply Wed 7 Apr, 2010 03:43 am
@north,
north;149074 wrote:
not in what creates it , just what constitutes wisdom



and then what is wisdom ?

without defining wisdom , how does one " try to be it " ?

Does it seem like a contradiction??? Wisdom is not something that can be defined as an object apart from people... A rock can "be"...A butterfly can "be"; and so be defined to an extent that is not possible with Wisdom, which is an infinite attribute of infinite beings...People are defined as wise, and wisdom defines people, and not all people, but certain people, and there it is two infinites giving meaning to each other, neither one of which will bear further definition...You cannot de-fine in-fin-ites... And if people were not forever trying to do so, philosophy would not be much excercise...
So you can be wise without a definition of wise because people are defined by the term as much as the term is defined by those we consider to be wise...
 
north
 
Reply Thu 8 Apr, 2010 09:20 pm
@Fido,
Quote:
Originally Posted by north http://www.philosophyforum.com/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
not in what creates it , just what constitutes wisdom



and then what is wisdom ?

without defining wisdom , how does one " try to be it " ?





Fido;149177 wrote:
Does it seem like a contradiction??? Wisdom is not something that can be defined as an object apart from people... A rock can "be"...A butterfly can "be"; and so be defined to an extent that is not possible with Wisdom, which is an infinite attribute of infinite


not yet understanding you here


Quote:
beings...People are defined as wise, and wisdom defines people, and not all people, but certain people, and there it is two infinites giving meaning to each other, neither one of which will bear further


don't get you again

Quote:
definition...You cannot de-fine in-fin-ites... And if people were not forever trying to do so, philosophy would not be much excercise...


I see

so infinity is the basis of your argument

hmm...

Quote:
So you can be wise without a definition of wise because people are defined by the term as much as the term is defined by those we consider to be wise...


so what then determines who is wise and who is not ?

infinity included
 
north
 
Reply Thu 8 Apr, 2010 11:22 pm
@north,
wisedom has certain qualities

and they are true , throughout the extent of infinity
 
Pepijn Sweep
 
Reply Fri 9 Apr, 2010 03:27 am
@north,
north;149858 wrote:
wisedom has certain qualities

and they are true , throughout the extent of infinity


[CENTER]:bigsmile:
[/CENTER]

[CENTER]I think wisdom is relative to Time and Space and Species...

Wisdom as a Human quality is limited to human conditions;
a tool to survive.

Knowledge might be more a candidate for absolute value;
but is proven wrong so many Times.

Compassion atrrackted me for a while.
Like boeddhism because effect on behaviour of people.
Most Peacefull.


Mythology connects Humans & gods.
God was not all-ways the Same.

It was mainly a way to teach ethics and morals.


Now I think more holistic. I feel different traditions can teach each-other.

Yesterday I scrared a Jehova-witness away. Just by saying I read Gnostic teachers.
She run.
Laughing
One education is no education.
[/CENTER]

:cool:XY
 
Fido
 
Reply Fri 9 Apr, 2010 04:52 am
@north,
north;149810 wrote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by north http://www.philosophyforum.com/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
not in what creates it , just what constitutes wisdom



and then what is wisdom ?

without defining wisdom , how does one " try to be it " ?






not yet understanding you here




don't get you again



I see

so infinity is the basis of your argument

hmm...



so what then determines who is wise and who is not ?

infinity included

Wise is as wise does...How does the wise man live, and how does the society or community that is wise survive??? We are infinites, having no end, process not progress, and humanity can no more be judged than can the infinite qualities that give us meaning and make us what we are...Tell me your sense of them, and it is like you telling me of the sea seeing only its surface...
 
north
 
Reply Sun 11 Apr, 2010 08:19 pm
@Fido,
wisedom has certain qualities

and they are true , throughout the extent of infinity
 
Fido
 
Reply Sun 11 Apr, 2010 09:06 pm
@north,
north;150654 wrote:
wisedom has certain qualities

and they are true , throughout the extent of infinity

Are you now the master of infinities??? Stand on any railroad track (but not for too long) and you can see infinity because you cannot see the end of it... We may guess there is an end to it, and may have even followed it to its destination; but what of all the infinites one cannot follow to their ends??? To presume an end to anything without knowing, and then to describe the end without seeing is only ignorance... Now; I will forgive your ignorance if you forgive mine, but are not all moral forms as Wisdom is, infinite??? It cannot be cut of an defined because it is not finite, infinite...No one has ever laid an ounce of wisdom upon a scale, so you should not pretend the thing is killed and mounted on your wall... Tell me what you believe it is given the evidence, and show your evidence...Don't pretend you know all about any infinite...
 
north
 
Reply Sun 11 Apr, 2010 09:13 pm
@Fido,
Quote:
Originally Posted by north http://www.philosophyforum.com/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
wisedom has certain qualities

and they are true , throughout the extent of infinity




Fido;150666 wrote:
Are you now the master of infinities??? Stand on any railroad track (but not for too long) and you can see infinity because you cannot see the end of it... We may guess there is an end to it, and may have even followed it to its destination; but what of all the infinites one cannot follow to their ends??? To presume an end to anything without knowing, and then to describe the end without seeing is only ignorance... Now; I will forgive your ignorance if you forgive mine, but are not all moral forms as Wisdom is, infinite??? It cannot be cut of an defined because it is not finite, infinite...No one has ever laid an ounce of wisdom upon a scale, so you should not pretend the thing is killed and mounted on your wall... Tell me what you believe it is given the evidence, and show your evidence...Don't pretend you know all about any infinite...


is wisdom just based on moral forms ?
 
Reconstructo
 
Reply Sun 11 Apr, 2010 09:16 pm
@Fido,
Fido;133060 wrote:
If wisdom is understanding, then it is the ability to envision the whole on the basis of a couple of pieces of the whole...We should never forget that we are looking at one thing, the monad in all its variation, and to know the parts we must know the parts, but that is not wisdom, but to find the unity no one can grasp takes a skill which is natural, inate, and is one that requires insight which one may build upon and no one can buy...


The unity! Yes. I was walking w a friend in this cemetary, and some theologian's stone had some Greek on it. My friend used his I-phone or the like to look up the quote in revelation. Holy Holy Holy. Which is perfection = wholeness in the context of he who is, and was, and shall be. Now neither of us is religious in the crude sense, but God as a symbol as the intelligible unity of things is nice. And I thought it was a tasteful quote for a stone. I wonder how it sounds in Greek.

---------- Post added 04-11-2010 at 10:22 PM ----------

Fido;150666 wrote:
Are you now the master of infinities??? Stand on any railroad track (but not for too long) and you can see infinity because you cannot see the end of it... We may guess there is an end to it, and may have even followed it to its destination; but what of all the infinites one cannot follow to their ends??? To presume an end to anything without knowing, and then to describe the end without seeing is only ignorance... Now; I will forgive your ignorance if you forgive mine, but are not all moral forms as Wisdom is, infinite??? It cannot be cut of an defined because it is not finite, infinite...No one has ever laid an ounce of wisdom upon a scale, so you should not pretend the thing is killed and mounted on your wall... Tell me what you believe it is given the evidence, and show your evidence...Don't pretend you know all about any infinite...


This reminds me of a recent math discovery. In trig, angles are measured in relation to pi. Of course pi cannot be written algebraically. But the symbol is both accurate and useful if taken for the mystery it is. It's the same with the lemniscate. (lazy eight). If we are careful with our words, and humble before our pseudo-infinities, we can live better. This is why I love negative theology. It's all about what we don't know and can't know about the infinite. It's essentially humble. It circles around the mystery. Cusanus used the metaphor of a polygon with infinite sides for knowledge of god. But all of us mortals have a finite number of sides, which means partial knowledge of something that transcends us. And yet to know what we can and can't know is worthwhile knowledge, yes? So the subject is worth investigation, to say the least.

I think a lot of confusion comes from mistaking the math infinite, which is usable, with the philosophical or ethical infinite, which is more complicated.
??

---------- Post added 04-11-2010 at 10:23 PM ----------

Pepijn Sweep;149883 wrote:
[CENTER]:bigsmile:
[/CENTER]

[CENTER]Wisdom as a Human quality is limited to human conditions;
a tool to survive.


[/CENTER]
:cool:XY


Can we also add the notion of not only surviving but living a better life? Wisdom as an increase in quality and satisfaction?
 
Fido
 
Reply Sun 11 Apr, 2010 09:25 pm
@north,
north;150668 wrote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by north http://www.philosophyforum.com/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
wisedom has certain qualities

and they are true , throughout the extent of infinity





is wisdom just based on moral forms ?

Wisdom is a moral form... SSince we annot judge it because it is an infinite,, it purpose as a quasi concept must be to judge humanity...
 
north
 
Reply Sun 11 Apr, 2010 10:31 pm
@Fido,
Fido;150675 wrote:
Wisdom is a moral form... SSince we annot judge it because it is an infinite,, it purpose as a quasi concept must be to judge humanity...


you do not understand wisdom
 
Fido
 
Reply Mon 12 Apr, 2010 03:44 am
@north,
north;150705 wrote:
you do not understand wisdom

Never said I did... My relationship with ignorance has been long term and difficult; but wisdom is rare everywhere...What you say of me I will agree with, and not just with my myself, but for all: As an infinite, Wisdom is beyond understanding..
 
north
 
Reply Tue 13 Apr, 2010 10:48 pm
@Fido,
Quote:
Originally Posted by north http://www.philosophyforum.com/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
you do not understand wisdom



Fido;150770 wrote:
Never said I did... My relationship with ignorance has been long term and difficult; but wisdom is rare everywhere...What you say of me I will agree with, and not just with my myself, but for all:


for many not all

Quote:
As an infinite, Wisdom is beyond understanding..


then you don't understand
 
 

 
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