Well but if you go to the ultimate Reality, necessary is sufficient...it is the case the world it is what it is...what comes next is caused from this on, is n?t it ?

Why not? People sometimes do things even if they don't want to do them. I used to visit my old aunt in hospital even though I really, really, did not want to do so. Sometimes people just have to do things they don't want to do. Isn't that true in Portugal?

I have never been to UR. Where is it located? The best I can do is try to discover un-ultimate reality. And sometimes that's hard enough. When next you go, please pay my respects.

Are you implying somehow that there really was no cause for what it happened ? I don?t think so...

1- Or you were the cause and could not do but what you chose, given you had a reason...(a cause)
2- Or someone make you do it, and you could not change it, since there was a cause for you to not be able...

Are you implying somehow that there really was no cause for what it happened ? I don?t think so...

1- Or you were the cause and could not do but what you chose, given you had a reason...(a cause)
2- Or someone make you do it, and you could not change it, since there was a cause for you to not be able...

No, I am not implying that, for I believe that determinism is true. But I am saying that I sometimes do things I do not want to do. So wanting to do something is not the only cause for doing it. (In fact, there are times I do things I not merely don't want to do, but I want not to do). But that does not imply there was no cause for doing it, of course. Why is that relevant anyway.

"The beginning" is a necessary condition (a partial cause) for all the decisions I have ever made. This does not entail "the beginning" is causally sufficient (fully causal) for all the decisions I have ever made since I am also the partial cause of my actions. "The beginning" in conjunction with my decisions to act are causally sufficient. "The beginning" is not causally sufficient.

Granted. Now sum up all that, and give me a result...like 2+2=4 shows the cause, and the result cannot be otherwise !

You are a consequence of the beginning if there are causes, you are not out of the sciope of the set and initial conditions, are you ?

"2+2=4" is necessarily true in all possible worlds regardless of initial conditions (or causes).

Each condition is necessary for my doing x. Each condition is not sufficient for my doing x.

Exactly, but the sum of all necessary conditions make the cause and the case that it could not have been differently...it comes to be sufficient !

I am partial necessary cause. The conjunction of past conditions along with my decision to act is causally sufficient for the outcome (the effect). So of course the future could have been differently if I had so chosen it to be different. I have causal power.

Granted. Now sum up all that, and give me a result...like 2+2=4 shows the cause, and the result cannot be otherwise !

---------- Post added 05-08-2010 at 10:47 AM ----------

If you are the cause to your actions and you incorporate the set of the World, how could you do differently, of what you have reason, a cause, to do has you do ? unless of course there is no causes or hard Determinism is true ?

You continue to assert the same modal fallacy over and over again. You're not listening. If I had chosen differently than I would have acted thus. It is not necessary that I act thus.

The result of necessary cause world, from which you emerged, and your reason to act (also necessary) should be sufficient to chose A not B without otherwise.

Translation please. But remember, saying something is true does not make it true. It is not even evidence that it is true.

The result of necessary cause world, from which you emerged, and your reason to act (also necessary) should be sufficient to chose A not B without otherwise.

Perhaps. That is how I have causal power. But my reason's for doing X are not sufficient reasons. So it is still false that I could not have a different reason for my doing Y instead of my doing X.

But were did I said it was, lately, for the purpose of debate in course I don?t even need to...the final fact is you could not have done otherwise if all necessary causes are sum up.

The sum of all necessary causes rise sufficient cause to A rather then B.
So how could have been otherwise ???

but that need not be true. He may many reasons not to visit his mother, but if he wanted to do so, he would. Evil son!

were are this many reasons if a the time he decides they were weighted and he chose what he chose necessarily and sufficiently, given all causes sum up ? ( him and the world )