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Ghost you dont hear what my family say about me or you would not accuse me of not wanting to believe.I can believe if the evidence is sound, i can believe that governments can manipulate the truth but i cant believe we have these layers of truth that can be hidden one from the other. I cant believe a government that is so opposed to the reliance of ME oil and is fighting wars to obtain it would be so against free power. It would transform american economy , it would save the world from green house gases it would stop weather dominating our future lives..Sorry free energy plants miles underground and flying saucers made by humans that can fly at light speed nnnnoooo its too much.I believe in the possibility of aliens visiting us, whatever that means, but this other stuff... sorry a giant step for me..I have listened and heard their witness some are convincing others very convincing and lots i dont believe..
Are you a scoffer or a sceptic ?
would you find a jumbo with this telescope or even a cloud at 10000 feet.Its perspective.Its the same as seeing a beach ball pass your view when looking out to sea at a sailing boat with binoculars.
So with all these poor academicians up there at 14,000 feet trying to discover something interesting to become famous, using the best technology we have, why is it that the footage of flying saucers comes from people on the ground using a camcorder they picked up at Best Buy?
About 6% of the population has had one or more sightings of UFO's.
The level of public acceptance is probably about 90% of the population.
I suppose the counterargument is that they have cloaking devices.
can any of these telescopes see into the lower light spectrum?
a lot, if not most of it, is operated by the Government
That's simply not true. The government doesn't operate any of the telescopes on Mauna Kea, and that's the highest concentration of telescopes in one place on earth. Virtually all major telescopes are operated by universities. They're usually owned by one university and they rent out time to researchers from other universities, and for the most part they aren't even funded by the government. The only thing that may be owned by the government is the land that the telescopes are built on, but the land is leased to whoever wants to build a telescope there.
I know more now, I revised my statement after you quoted it -- NASA operates one IR telescope on Mauna Kea.
I guess the point is that with CalTech, UCLA, and many independent nations operating telescopes, you have to theorize that all these other agencies have been unable to corroborate the government findings, or that the government themselves have never found anything. Because something as enormous as discovering an alien ship would not stay a secret for more than 2 seconds if a grad student from CalTech found it up there.
I know more now, I revised my statement after you quoted it -- NASA operates one IR telescope on Mauna Kea.
I guess the point is that with CalTech, UCLA, and many independent nations operating telescopes, you have to theorize that all these other agencies have been unable to corroborate the government findings, or that the government themselves have never found anything. Because something as enormous as discovering an alien ship would not stay a secret for more than 2 seconds if a grad student from CalTech found it up there.
Joe this Richard Hoagland is a wind bag ,what he claims about the face on mars is hog wash. This where i become annoyed that every dam thing that is claimed about NASA the governments , free power and all the other razzmatazz detracts from the real honest stories. I think those who push these extreme views are the real conspirators they are the ones who are stopping the real truth from being explored.
Scientists have the same information as anyone else. So far, there haven't been too many explanations proposed. If there are others, I'd love to hear them. But, what we have is:
[INDENT]1. They're here because they are curious - very unlikely because of the assumptions that anyone would undoubtedly make about the ramifications of their conspicuousness. What would be more likely is that many separate ET civilizations have stumbled upon earth in the past, and have opted to move on for some reason. What could that reason be? There is an indication though, based on the enormous land sketches in South America, that life tends to "evolve" into distinct categories (i.e. arthropods, bipeds, winged creatures, etc.).
2. They're here for "scientific" study - simply not realistic, since the fair assumption is that they would already know what results to expect. It's just too pointless.
3. They control the earth for their gain - most likely, because we see evidence that intelligent beings tend to do that all the time.
[/INDENT]Anything else?
IF we admit they could exist and they are if we suppose arriving from a distant galaxy at light speed do you think they might just have the ability to stop inside the earth atmosphere where telescopes are not focused. This silly nit picking about where they come from and a oh ye i bet this or that.If we are dealing with aliens we cant restrict their activity to our understanding .We each have to say with the mountain of evidence is there something to consider or are we constantly being lied to by these who make these claims..We have been shown documented high profile witnesses but it has been ignored by the majority and then suddenly telescopes have had the effect of bringing out the usual silent majority.
Why they might be here..They are us from the future observing our pathetic past.They may be from another dimension curios sightseers.The big ones are the cruise ships and the small ones ferry boats to observe us up close.The tourist you might see in huddled groups that dont like you joining their party are really aliens on a cruise ."Danger cruises" for the adventurous tourist come visit the earth no holiday insurance available..next cruise leaving alpha ventura in six yakdays.
MOD Note: Please refrain from double posting - Posts merged!
This thread tends to get way off topic very quickly. Ghost, since this is your thread, you have the responsibility of sticking to your OP. If you entertain these pointless exchanges about whether or not aliens are here, then you increase the chances that this thread will be closed.
Pusyphus wrote:
1. They're here because they are curious - very unlikely because of the assumptions that anyone would undoubtedly make about the ramifications of their conspicuousness. What would be more likely is that many separate ET civilizations have stumbled upon earth in the past, and have opted to move on for some reason. What could that reason be? There is an indication though, based on the enormous land sketches in South America, that life tends to "evolve" into distinct categories (i.e. arthropods, bipeds, winged creatures, etc.).
2. They're here for "scientific" study - simply not realistic, since the fair assumption is that they would already know what results to expect. It's just too pointless.
3. They control the earth for their gain - most likely, because we see evidence that intelligent beings tend to do that all the time.
Anything else?
Also Ghost, play devil's advocate and do your best to invent a military strategy for hoaxing the idea of alien "visitors" so at least it looks like you are considering the realistic, if not fabricated, objections...
I really can't see any reason reason they would hoax something like that....the only reason I can think of still involves real Aliens: They military is injecting fake testimonies into the Disclosure Project, among other things, stating really crazy and wild things, in an attempt to make the whole thing look sketchy, unreliable and unrespectable, so that we are unable to pull any truth from all the lies, and essentially, we become unable to make sense of anything, and just throw the whole thing out.
Well, that goes back to the idea that there would be some sort of military advantage to making people think alien technology exists. I've tried to imagine some sort of realistic military advantage, and I haven't been successful. I'll try it again...Let's see, our military wants other countries to know that it's possible for such technology to exist, but only for some alien species that must be advanced beyond us by thousands of years. And oh yeah, they've decided to side with the Americans, because...Nope! I just can't do it.
Change "2. They're here for "scientific" study" to "2. They're here for scientific, philosophical, and spiritual study". I assume that these beings are highly advanced, so much so that they were are able to engineer our species, but they did it for a reason, will goals in mind, they still have a lot of philosophical and spiritual things to understand, especially when it comes to the development of an intelligent species from scratch, the amount of invaluable knowledge that could be gained from such a study, is enormous, and as I said before, there isn't much left to do after a billion years but play God, and learn from it.
Well it's about time, Ghost. :a-ok: And it only took a little over 200 posts to get a well-constructed (valid) conclusion outta ya. Since I don't have enough info available to dispute this claim, I have to admit that it's worth considering. However, for such an endeavor to be considered a controlled experiment, wouldn't it be necessary to stage the world events that we see?
If not, please explain. (IOW, wouldn't the widespread confusion over the existence of aliens, by definition, corrupt the experiment? Couldn't it be shown that you could piss just about anyone off, by coming and going as you please, without saying a word? Wouldn't they have already screwed the pooch, as it were?)
"3. They control the earth for their gain - most likely, because we see evidence that intelligent beings tend to do that all the time." Yeah, we see our selfish, arrogant little selves trying to control Earth, and even arm space in an attempt to own it. What do you think they are attempting to gain by controlling Earth and how are they controlling it?
Well, that goes back to the idea that there would be some sort of military advantage to making people think alien technology exists. I've tried to imagine some sort of realistic military advantage, and I haven't been successful. I'll try it again...Let's see, our military wants other countries to know that it's possible for such technology to exist, but only for some alien species that must be advanced beyond us by thousands of years. And oh yeah, they've decided to side with the Americans, because...Nope! I just can't do it.
Well it's about time, Ghost. :a-ok: And it only took a little over 200 posts to get a well-constructed (valid) conclusion outta ya. Since I don't have enough info available to dispute this claim, I have to admit that it's worth considering. However, for such an endeavor to be considered a controlled experiment, wouldn't it be necessary to stage the world events that we see?
If not, please explain. (IOW, wouldn't the widespread confusion over the existence of aliens, by definition, corrupt the experiment? Couldn't it be shown that you could piss just about anyone off, by coming and going as you please, without saying a word? Wouldn't they have already screwed the pooch, as it were?
What do I think they're trying to gain?
I dunno. Gold? Diamonds? You tell me. What do you spend your hard-earned money on?