Haha alright. First off, I will say i am writing this for my self. I am not trying to impose any morals or beliefs on anyone BUT if i do come across arrogant or presumptuous, i apologize in advance. Any "is or musts" thrown around are for clarity, not attacking any ideas.
Why should it bother you if you are being a true concern toward yourself?
I believe that life is an end in itself.
My(long, disorganized, mystic) Premise:
1.) God is not suceptible to empirical inquiry, deductive logic, sensory perception(ive never seen him at least) or any variant of reason.
2.) Reason is the shovel for all human knowledge.(Our only means of achieving knowledge)
3.) God isn't in any hole(Reason can't be ascribed to him)
4.) Religion imposes morals on its adherents(Ten Commandments or whatever)
5.) I can't live my life based on an entity(that cannot even be an entity) and adhering to "his"(or her) morals/values/standards/what have you.
6.) I live my life based on my deductions, my convictions, my knowledge, gained from MY use of reason, not blind(or nearsighted) faith.
7.) If god wants to damn me for eternity(whatever that is) for finding heaven on earth, using a code of morals grounded in reality rather than fantasy, then i guess i'm effed.(And he ain't so benevolent.)
Not as disorganised as myslef.
1.) Empirical; 1 based on experiment, observation, or experience, rather than on theory (all depends on how you see it) 2 regarding experiment and observation as more important than scientific law. From Greek 'empeiria' experience.
Maybe not suceptible, but certainly measurable, if even just pretending to not find God where God is.
You may never have seen 'him' but you can kbnow that God is there, sensory, you sense It.
2.) Reason is ondeed as you describe a shovel, however we dont all need to dig to know (truth). And many truths are not reasonable, (at least the way i sense them).
Knowledge is achievment, please elaborate on it reason being the only action and or implement that can bring knowledge.
Are we born with knowledge, the capasity to know, are we ever with out knowledge or reason? (for being)
And knowledge is often gift, is gift achievment?
3.) No God isn't in any hole, but the reason that it was dug for us to get outof, for us as much as for 'him' hmmm?
4.) Religion in it' sbest form, is a structure inquiry of all and adepts alike, it asks of the parishioners rather than tells, you dont honestly think people are so stupid that they dont know what is good to do and what is bad to do? People dont just do it because they are told, they do it because it makes sense. It is reasonable. It is truthful.
The question would be, does it ask us somethihng we already know? (Ought and should on stand by.)
Nothing can impose upon you better than yourself.
Entity; Something that has a physical existence, as opposed to a quality or mood 2 the essential nature (of something) 3 philos, the fact or quality of existing. From Latin 'entitas' from 'ens', thing that exists.
Agreed cannot be other than all, or, else.
It is, or it is not.
5.)Again the way you live your life is your choice, of your choosing, hear them and choose, dont dismiss before inquiry, dont dismiss on the basis that someone is 'telling' you something. They may just be reasonable and correct answers.
6.) Deductions, your inquirys.
Convictions, your beliefs.
Knowledge, your experiences.
Gained from your use of reason, or is that understanding? (method of)
7.)Why would 'god' want to damn you? especially for eternity?
No God is not benevolent (if not the reaosn for it) that is what is required of us.
We have to teach God good as well learn what God already knows to have goodness about it.
We must teach our benevolence for God to believe in us.
We have to show meticulously our intentions and actions, heavenly, moraly, realistically, (which all measn we must learn/live it, love it,) teach it tell it.
Hope i didn't spare you to much piety there?
Piety is a form of reason if not reasoning.
Im not saying he doesnt exist so spare me the piety
1.) We live in a society
2.) Society(or at least our narrow minded society) has laws!
3.) Laws tell you what you can and can't do(inhibit absolute freedom)
4.) Our govt. and its legislation impose values(commercial, moral, etc.) on citizens
bad exs. 1.)Gun Laws(discourage gun ownership)
2.) Alcohol Age(discourages intoxication)
5.) My values will inevitably conflict with society's(especially liberals)
6.) I do not wish to be a means to an end of society.
Your values will inevitably reach society if they are the most reasonable and popularly understandable. (this could be question as much a statement)
'6.) I do not wish to be a means to an end of society' Elaborate on that please
End Product: My life is an end in itself, with happiness my purpose.
Post Script: i will gladly elaborate on any of this if you request.
Your end product, is the process over purpose or the process that achieves your purpose.
Which is a good one.
But what is happiness to or with you?
Is it the search or what is found? (for a start)
Thanks for your time
---------- Post added 12-12-2009 at 01:32 AM ----------
Death is (I think) the end of experience. I enjoy experience.
Life is both beautiful and tragic. I do not fear death the thought just makes me sad.
Now imagine for those who also do not fear death but are glad for it, and the ever opportunity they have had.
---------- Post added 12-12-2009 at 01:36 AM ----------
"Oh and because it would leave an awful mess." (jes)
In a nut shell or what.
"So is this that there will inevitably always be mess, or do you have a messy death in mind?" (sometime sun)
There will usually be mess, albeit social, emotional, physical etc. Worse case scenario: Some one else decides to kick-the-bucket because you have; double the mess!
Not one death is without any mess, it is how we who are left to clean up is what we can learn grow and even celebrate that is our own lagacy.
---------- Post added 12-12-2009 at 01:40 AM ----------
Mess -- If I had to do the deed,
Now there is a nutshell worth exploring.
Emphasis on the 'had'.
---------- Post added 12-12-2009 at 01:44 AM ----------
To put it simply I enjoy my life! It doesnt get much more complicated than that. I would probably say that life is probably absurd and meaningless but that doesnt prevent me from being happy. To quote Camus 'It would be a mistake to say that happiness necessarily springs from the absurd. Discovery. It happens as well that the felling of the absurd springs from happiness'
Again, can one ever enjoy their death?
An example of how happiness is not contingent upon inevitability but more upon probability.
---------- Post added 12-12-2009 at 01:47 AM ----------
the thought of being crushed and trapped by an earthquake or mine disaster makes me a tad fearful. death by very very slow asphyxiation...or dentist. fearful. marathon fearful.
But that would not be by your choice, so is death by choice less fearful and a good reason to exact upon the self?
---------- Post added 12-12-2009 at 01:57 AM ----------
1. As far as I know, this is the only chance I'll have to experience this life (or anything else for that matter). Why give up that opportunity? 2. The only good reason that I, personally, could come up with to commit suicide would be extreme curiosity. Therein lies one of my greatest weaknesses as a human being, though: impatience.
'As far as you know', i like a man who can admit his ignorances. This is good for the reason that you have not yet decided been proven ever expect an answer but upon launch.
Now what if you had found this solvancy, what if you knew you could die and it would not matter, matter beacause there is more, or no more to contend with? What if you knew something that gave you the absolution that only death knows what the gift is but you are convinced of therefore in possession of truth?
But you are not curious enough to push for something you will find your inevitability in at some spot in your future, life and solution.
Is it impatience that some might go on before insisted? (although the act is nothing but insistence of self), good question.
But why not? is surely the fuller answer.
---------- Post added 12-12-2009 at 02:05 AM ----------
The Outsider;109892 wrote:
The simple answer is to be happy. Or, rather, to try to be happy. And all I really mean by that is to live in accordance with one's own will. Which is undeniable, I think. Can one deny their own will? I don't understand how. Obviously, though, by living according to their will, some have come to the point of ending their lives. For these people, they believed their greatest happiness (or lack of suffering) lie in death. Personally, I am still quite skeptical of that, and so I live.
On a broader note, given that by living (by which I include all intentional actions, e.g. suicide) we aim for happiness, the question is why be happy? I do not have an answer for that. My thought is that happiness is apathetic of suffering. Which allows happiness to be an end in itself. Whatever that means.
Not yet happy , not yet dead,
you have not there, found it yet.
Dont get the 'apathetic of suffering' bit. Please elaborate.