Resistance is futile

What I mean by eqaulity is, the way I see it is when you meet a person, they could be in any situation, I find that some people would think that the situation makes a person less of an equal, like for instance you go to Africa and an arrogant person would think he's better than a tribesman because the tribesman choses to live without material things, same as if I bump into a homeless person or a waitress I would try not to think I am any better than them as in 'im a better person', that to me is judgemental and conceited.

Its impossible to not do so, we all hold views of whats best or worse in a human and we all make relations between types of humans we reconize and those values.

Yes but your view would change if the waitress became a president or the homeless person sorted himself out and got a good job, then that person would go up in your view so yes we recognise values in a person but only when they chose to show it, the fact they have done something worthy of our attention means that we are all equal to begin with and although that is hard to percieve whilst he is still down and out it maybe worthwhile to bear that thought, (that we are all equal), in the back of your mind if only to give you humility.

Yes but just like we fail to ignore our fear of heights then jumping off a high place even then we are going to fall on water, we cannot ignore completly our subjective judments of people just because we know that we dont actually know anything about then. We can only try

Yes you can only try it is hard but not impossible? Im not actually saying ignore them as that is ni on impossible but I find that i have to tell myself there and then that they are no better than me or the next person in order for me to treat them as an eqaul and not look down on them coz that doesn't help the situation,eg. if someone comes to me for help i can help them better if I dont make them feel inferior to me by thinking and demonstrating to them that i think im superior. It doesn't really matter what you think what counts is what you show to the person you're helping, for instance i could feel absolutely disgusted about some things about the person im trying to help but i wouldnt show it!

I make an effort to avoid judging books by the cover but not to hide the fact that I am making an effort

I just think that it is better that people know the truth, even if it is bad for my image, and im working towards getting better at being honest.

I wasn't talking about image I was talking about the situation, like for example in my work i have to leave my personel judgements about people at home in order to be professional in order to help my client so it doesn't really matter what i think about the person as long as i dont reflect that on them or else it would totally defeat the object which is to help them nothing to do with how i want others to percieve me it's to do with getting a good result for them, my client.

At the end of the day i dont really judge a person.
I dont start the process unless i really have to in other words if my mind has the urge and maybe my mind is urging me for good reasons like to protect myself, there are good reasons to judge and bad reasons as you make mistakes.

Yeah but even if you arent thinking in your image, it is, from your description, less I utterly misinterpreted it, what you have to keep to prevent what you think from reflecting into your clients. I dont think I could do that, so, good job

No not really i dont think i judge them on what they've done in the past but i will judge them on what they do in the present and until that changes that judgement will remain, and i will judge someone after i've got to know them a little but it's constantly changing, you cant help make judgements and you do it for a reason, to form an realistic opinion of someone, (well as realistic a possible), for whatever reasons, for example i would judge that person to be a risk or not so that's a good reason to hold judgement.

I guess i just dont think about it and it makes it easier because i haven't experienced whatever they done, i haven't seen it. All i know is that im paid not to judge but to help and i find i can do that quite easily however if i was to experience or think about what people have done then of course depending on what they did i would pass judgement but im not asked too am i and i quite like that:)

I take it you really loved reading Aristotle and the Nicomachaean Ethics. :bigsmile:

Come again?......

I just had a look at it, (I dont claim to have read alot of philosophy which is why i love this forum so much, you folks make me read),after looking at it i see what you mean, i will study it at a further date as one has work in the morning!

Just to offer an addition to the discussion:

Equality and equity are usefully different. That is, equity is the sharing out of resources (time, money, etc...) based on need. I think equity is an entirely reasonable goal to strive for. Objectively, most resources can be measured, and no matter how crudely, there is a degree of measurement in need. Therefore, perhaps it is entirely possible for equity to exist at an organised level (albeit debatable whether humankind is capable of such complex sentiment).

Equality, is more troublesome. Perhaps that is why we discuss "equal opportunity", as opposed to equality. But I agree with Boagie,

'This is the basic contract that society has with the individual, when it is broken, as when society allows the homeless to die hungry in the cold, then, the contract is broken, society has broken the contract and the homeless owe no allegiance to the contract, to the society.'

A base equal provision may well be essential for civilisation, and hence the space we have to discuss such issues. In this sense then, perhaps equality is logical.

We are individual, but we are not equal. Perhaps one day simply being individual will be enough, but, given the challenges to our civilisation - the failure to uphold the contract of provision to those within it -, being individual is not enough, and therefore we are not equal in contribution or use, albeit, as Caroline says, perhaps no individual is in a position to judge whether one is less equal than another... we can only better ourselves.

Daniel

I don't believe that social equality is achievable in contemporary society. Conflict is inherent to human nature (group forming). Additionally, existing group-conflicts mandate a loser in any social situation.

Yeah well i believe we got a choice , it maybe conflict is inherent but so is living at peace with your neighbor, im not a sheep i dont follow what the rest of the group decides.

We have a choice, but there will always be someone that screws up the system, unhappyfully.

Is there equality?

As there is truth, equal and truth are One or the same.
The truth of Oneself = the truth of All.
How simple truth really is!
One,

=
MJA