Dave Allen;98543 wrote:
Well, I'm glad someone bothered to read my post properly.
Now, to my mind this is a sexist set up - because the aim of the feminist movement, to my eyes at least, is to propagate the idea that women are as capable of success in all fields that men are, and that notions that women are less capable in certain fields than men is simply a construct of culture.
Therefore preconceived notions of what a woman is good or bad at should be set aside.
In this sense the way women are treated under Sharia is a vicious circle - the fact that women do not tend to adopt postions of expertise in the financial sector is then used to justify why they shouldn't be trusted as financial advisors and hence leads to them not being employed, or seeking employment, in the financial sector (as a general rule).
This would seem sexist to me, because it declares by fiat that women are less able in a given area (a fact not bourne out by the experience of cultures that allow them to practice with less prejudice) and of course that will feed back to their ability to get along in such an environment.
I understand your point. However, Islam acknowledges the biological differences between men and women, and the laws and practices of society are built upwards from this fact. Women biologically give birth and are better equipped than men to care for a child, especially in its infancy, and so their roles as mothers are encouraged and allowed to flourish by declaring it compulsory for men to work and provide for their wives and families. Women can work if they wish and anything they earn can be kept for themselves. But first and foremost, their roles as mothers are given great importance, as it is the mother who shapes society. Almost every social ill in the Western world can be traced back to the breakdown of the family unit. So Islam is setup so the family unit is kept strong through each individual playing a certain role. I understand the role of feminism but I strongly believe that there is nothing demeaning or lowly about being a dedicated mother and not chasing after a career. With this in mind, it is a natural result that the average woman may not be as confident in matters of finance as the average man. A woman in Islam could become the MD of a financial firm if she wants, but this would usually be an exception, not the rule. So yes, I agree when you say women will be less capable than men in certain fields due to construct of culture, but I don't necessarily see this as a bad thing. The same can be said of men in relation to women.
"In this sense the way women are treated under Sharia is a vicious circle - the fact that women do not tend to adopt postions of expertise in the financial sector is then used to justify why they shouldn't be trusted as financial advisors and hence leads to them not being employed, or seeking employment, in the financial sector (as a general rule)."
You are right to a degree, yes. But women in Islam hold just as important position in society as men. They just occupy different positions.
"This would seem sexist to me, because it declares by fiat that women are less able in a given area (a fact not bourne out by the experience of cultures that allow them to practice with less prejudice) and of course that will feed back to their ability to get along in such an environment."
The same can be said of men. Is a man being discriminated against because he has to go out and work? Or because he has to go to the mosque five times a day whilst his wife can pray in the comfort of her home? I don't really see it as sexism when you look at both sides although I can see why it would seem so to you.
The proposed intentions are not the realities. I will not go down the route of links, if i can help it, but just look at the practical examples of sharia law in operation and it ain't pretty. The law states that a woman's evidence is not the equal of mans and that gives certain communities the legality of convicting a women who has been raped, of being an adulterer, Pakistan is a prime example.
Telling me a women is less able that a men in any sense is never going to convince me Islam is not sexists. Its not just that it was possible the case a thousand years ago but it is protrayed even now in many Muslim households, the men use it as authority.
i find it an insult that the excuse of too many women in society qualifies a man to indulge his sexual fantasies. If he wants to be charitable he does not have wed and bed them. Funny they are never grannies , more like virgin teenagers with every oppertunity to wed. Is it the opinion of the Koran, if society finds by disease women are at a premium, it could be considered women have four husbands?
There are no countries in the world which rule through sharia law. Not Saudi Arabia, not Iran and certainly not Pakistan. The instances you speak of are typical of oppressive societies and have nothing to do with the teachings of Islam.
I don't know how many Muslim households you've been in and studied but from my friends and family I see much mutual respect, love, compromise and co-operation between men and women.
All the wives of Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) other than Aisha were widows, some who were older than him. The example he set was to take care of women who were not really going to be able to find a husband, as men usually got married very early. Can I ask you a personal question - are you married? Having a wife is hardly a sexual fantasy (no disrespect meant to any women here, but you ladies are pretty hard work!) A wife means exactly that, wife! Not prostitute, girlfriend, or booty call. A wife must be cared for, she has rights over you, she is entitled to inheritance, as are any children you have with her. When she complains that the washing machine isn't working you're going to have to buy a new one. And when your second wife tells you the broadband connection is too slow and needs to upgrade to a higher speed your going to have to do some overtime my friend. And when you get on abit and you find that you don't have the sort of energy you used to, you're going to find that sex is not really that appealing.
Whether you like it or not, there is a wisdom behind such a set-up. Women are not obliged to marry a man who has other wives, but where a woman wants to why should she be denied?