The silliness of Christianity

@onetwopi,

onetwopi;157391 wrote:

This really got me thinking!

Does omnipotence imply you get everything you want?

I think that, by itself, no, but if you couple that with omniscience, then you always can and know how to change things so that they will be how you want then in the future, if you dont do that, then its your choice to not interfere, so you want to not interfere.

@Krumple,

Krumple;156100 wrote:

God shows up, gives the warning not to partake of the forbidden fruit. Then wanders off. A short time later he returns trying to find his two prized creations only to find them hiding from him. Once they confess that they broke the rule, he casts them out and curses the female. How convenient is that and not only that but didn't he know this was going to happen at the moment he is ripping Adams rib from his chest to make Eve in the first place? It seems a little silly that he never let on that Adam would eventually be kicked out. But this is my point, that god is a reactionary as if he has no idea what is about to happen.

If we apply some simple psycology, we do what is forbidden, what attracts us.

God might need a pretext to get rid of those annoying humans, just as we have an excuse to kick our kids out of our homes when they turn 18.

@manored,

manored;157567 wrote:

I think that, by itself, no, but if you couple that with omniscience, then you always can and know how to change things so that they will be how you want then in the future, if you dont do that, then its your choice to not interfere, so you want to not interfere.

Hmm .. does God's omniscience and omnipotence preclude man's free will? And you assume that sin, then, is the crux of it.

@onetwopi,

onetwopi;157706 wrote:

Hmm .. does God's omniscience and omnipotence preclude man's free will? And you assume that sin, then, is the crux of it.

Sort off. Humans do exactly what god wanted humans to do, humans sin, therefore god wanted humans to sin.

@manored,

manored;158031 wrote:

Sort off. Humans do exactly what god wanted humans to do, humans sin, therefore god wanted humans to sin.

God can both want humans not to sin, and yet, if His overriding priority is to maintain our free will, humans can still sin.

Thus rather than keep man from sinning(something God could not do based on His self-appointed priorities), God sent a savior to cleanse man of sin.

@Amperage,

Ha! I misread the post as the "stillness" of Christianity. I thought I might find something enlightening here but instead just the same old dead horse that I'm bored with kicking.

@manored,

manored;158031 wrote:

Sort off. Humans do exactly what god wanted humans to do, humans sin, therefore god wanted humans to sin.

I want America to be free. I would certainly prefer that people not protest at soldiers' funerals. But those soldiers died to defend the freedom that the protesters are exhibiting at their funeral.

Do I want the protesters to carry hateful signs like "baby killer" on a soldier's funeral procession? No. Would I rather take away their right to protest? Absolutely not.

Edit: sorry if this seems political -- certainly not the intent -- I just wanted to draw a parallel.

@onetwopi,

onetwopi;158240 wrote:

I want America to be free. I would certainly prefer that people not protest at soldiers' funerals. But those soldiers died to defend the freedom that the protesters are exhibiting at their funeral.

Do I want the protesters to carry hateful signs like "baby killer" on a soldier's funeral procession? No. Would I rather take away their right to protest? Absolutely not.

Edit: sorry if this seems political -- certainly not the intent -- I just wanted to draw a parallel.

Why did USA go into Iraq? Seems you are a bit underinformed.

@Amperage,

Amperage;158053 wrote:

God can both want humans not to sin, and yet, if His overriding priority is to maintain our free will, humans can still sin.

Thus rather than keep man from sinning(something God could not do based on His self-appointed priorities), God sent a savior to cleanse man of sin.

If god didnt want humans to sin we wouldnt sin, there was no free will to be maintained then he made the decision, because we didnt exist yet.

onetwopi;158240 wrote:

I want America to be free. I would certainly prefer that people not protest at soldiers' funerals. But those soldiers died to defend the freedom that the protesters are exhibiting at their funeral.

Do I want the protesters to carry hateful signs like "baby killer" on a soldier's funeral procession? No. Would I rather take away their right to protest? Absolutely not.

But if you had made the personalities of these people, and if you knew their ever future action, wouldnt you have chosed a personality that would not lead then to make such protests?

HexHammer;158250 wrote:

Why did USA go into Iraq? Seems you are a bit underinformed.

He didnt specify it was the Iraq war and that is far from being the only war the USA ever was a part of.

@manored,

manored;158449 wrote:

He didnt specify it was the Iraq war and that is far from being the only war the USA ever was a part of.

Nor did I claim that prostesters only showed up at soldiers funeral for that war.

Usually USA has only waged war in the name of freedom, well all but when it comes to indians.

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;158250 wrote:

Why did USA go into Iraq? Seems you are a bit underinformed.

HexHammer;158668 wrote:

Nor did I claim that prostesters only showed up at soldiers funeral for that war.

Usually USA has only waged war in the name of freedom, well all but when it comes to indians.

You misjudge me, my intent, and you are using a word trap to lead the discussion off target, I fear. I never mentioned Iraq, and that had nothing to do with my point.

I am very well informed about our reasons for going to Iraq: stated, implied, and otherwise.

Back to the point, here's another analogy that maybe you will like better. I believe in freedom of speech, even though I may not believe in a protester holding a particular sign, I believe in his right to hold that sign and would not stop him even if I wholeheartedly disagreed with him.

Cheers!

@onetwopi,

onetwopi;158240 wrote:

I want America to be free. I would certainly prefer that people not protest at soldiers' funerals. But those soldiers died to defend the freedom that the protesters are exhibiting at their funeral.

Do I want the protesters to carry hateful signs like "baby killer" on a soldier's funeral procession? No. Would I rather take away their right to protest? Absolutely not.

Edit: sorry if this seems political -- certainly not the intent -- I just wanted to draw a parallel.

I see the parallel you have drawn. It appears to be a good comparison.

So God accepts our sin ,as the price of allowing freewill.
Or is he tolerant of our sin?
What exactly are you and I doing when it comes to phred?
Are we accepting, tolerating, or something else?
Are we simply paying dues to preserve our liberty?

@wayne,

wayne;158695 wrote:

I see the parallel you have drawn. It appears to be a good comparison.

So God accepts our sin ,as the price of allowing freewill.
Or is he tolerant of our sin?
What exactly are you and I doing when it comes to phred?
Are we accepting, tolerating, or something else?
Are we simply paying dues to preserve our liberty?

?

?

?

Dude?

You don't know much about the bible?

..maybe reading AND understanding the story about Noah, would be extremely relevant for you.

onetwopi;158694 wrote:

I am very well informed about our reasons for going to Iraq: stated, implied, and otherwise.

With your reasoning, I highly doubt that.

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;158745 wrote:

?

?

?

Dude?

You don't know much about the bible?

---------- Post added 05-01-2010 at 11:05 AM ----------

With your reasoning, I highly doubt that.

Why do you think that?

@wayne,

wayne;158748 wrote:

Why do you think that?

Because the story about Noah should eliminate your former post's questions.

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;158754 wrote:

Because the story about Noah should eliminate your former post's questions.

So you are saying that God doesn't tolerate sin?

@wayne,

wayne;158761 wrote:

So you are saying that God doesn't tolerate sin?

Please answer my assumption.

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;158763 wrote:

Please answer my assumption.

It really depends on how much you are saying I don't know.
I do know something about the bible.
I do however believe, there is much I do not know about the bible.

@wayne,

wayne;158769 wrote:

It really depends on how much you are saying I don't know.
I do know something about the bible.
I do however believe, there is much I do not know about the bible.

Excelent, then please tell me the morale of the story of Noah, I think it's a very notorious story which even the atheist should know a little about.

Maybe you have misunderstood the ending?

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;158775 wrote:

Excelent, then please tell me the morale of the story of Noah, I think it's a very notorious story which even the atheist should know a little about.

Maybe you have misunderstood the ending?

Well, God got fed up with man's sinful nature.
He saved Noah because he was righteous, and Noah saved the animals etc.
The thing is though, it didn't work, somehow sin got on the boat too and sin went right on doing what it does.
So I guess the moral could be, we're stuck with sin , you can't separate it from the man, we all have sin, even Noah must have been affected with it else it would have been lost in the flood.

Philosophy Forum

The silliness of Christianity

Quick Links

My Account

able2know