Avoidance of Fate

@sometime sun,

There is no reality to love, or liberty, or virtue, or justice; and yet people build their social forms out of these moral forms... When people pray for God's blessing, or say good luck, or worse, count on their good fortune against high odds they are refering back to a sort of conception of reality that is spiritual, which is to say: Moral, that is the underpining of all conceptions... We do not consider what a great advance animals made in becoming human, of being able to hold and transmit their concepts to others and even other generations...Fate is part and parcel of this sort of thinking, that the spirit was the thing, and the concept was the object... In this thought are the seeds of science... When people believed that pouring water on the ground would have a sympathetic effect of causing rain, or that a real animal could be conjured with a picture of that sort of beast, these were the first tentative steps toward science...The idea that our lives were controlled by some distant star we were born under was the beginning of astronomy out of astrology, but also a beginning of rational scientific inquiry... Fate was the beginning of fact, and whether or not you find it false, you should show more respect, because in the denial of fate mankind has been made human.....

@sometime sun,

my fate has been to repeat the same mistake over and over and no matter how much i learn from it the experience is totally new each time and i dont recognize it until it is all over. if fate isnt in the future, i think that is because there isnt any future-in a sense there isnt any past either, which is probably why i never get to learn anything from mistakes-there is no moving forward on a line towards death, we are already there. that is the worst fate of all-nowhere to go. i guess it must be that sissyfus thing...

@salima,

maybe change fate if IT is bad to U ?

@salima,

salima;159989 wrote:

my fate has been to repeat the same mistake over and over and no matter how much i learn from it the experience is totally new each time and i dont recognize it until it is all over. if fate isnt in the future, i think that is because there isnt any future-in a sense there isnt any past either, which is probably why i never get to learn anything from mistakes-there is no moving forward on a line towards death, we are already there. that is the worst fate of all-nowhere to go. i guess it must be that sissyfus thing...

Hmmm? Are you sure it's fate, and just not a bad habbit?

..and excatly what is this fate, if I may be so bold to ask?

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;160035 wrote:

..and excatly what is this fate, if I may be so bold to ask?

So far for me it has come out as an unavoidable inevitable.
And NOT the future but what is to come.

But Salima makes a point that fate has no basis in a time or frame that has not actually happened yet.

Fate is what happens in time, future is what is to come outside of time.

---------- Post added 05-04-2010 at 06:31 PM ----------

Fate is evolution, future is human?

@sometime sun,

sometime sun;160039 wrote:

So far for me it has come out as an unavoidable inevitable.
And NOT the future but what is to come.

But Salima makes a point that fate has no basis in a time or frame that has not actually happened yet.

Fate is what happens in time, future is what is to come outside of time.

For that newspaper I worked for, I made a terrible phrophecy for the boss, that his expantion in Europe would fail, his internet buisness would fail, and he would fail! All came true, in a very terrible real way.

His expantion in Europe would close the year after I foretold that phorphecy, the internet never gave a posetive yield under him, only a meager yield when he got demoted 4 years later for pulling a "Martha Stewart" (being too creative with the stocks). He lost all of his fortune 3.2 billion kr, now has a debt of 200 mill kr.

Imo fate is sometimes certain, and can be avoided by simple means.

@HexHammer,

What do seers, oracles, prophets have to do with fate?
What does fate have to do with them?

Fate is the outsome or fulfillment so is always certain.

@sometime sun,

sometime sun;160069 wrote:

What do seers, oracles, prophets have to do with fate?
What does fate have to do with them?

Fate is the outsome or fulfillment so is always certain.

.Sheer probability:detective::Glasses::poke-eye:

@sometime sun,

sometime sun;160069 wrote:

Fate is the outsome or fulfillment so is always certain.

Rubbish, if it so certain, then one can never be suprized.

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;160107 wrote:

Rubbish, if it so certain, then one can never be suprized.

Who said anything about being in possession of the rheumatisms of fate, just that fate will eventually destroy the joints.

The only unsuprising thing about fate is that we are all fated.

You dont have to know your existences fate to know fate exists.

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;160107 wrote:

Rubbish, if it so certain, then one can never be suprized.

In the trivial sense of "fate" in which sense it would be logically impossible for what is fated not to occur, fate is certain to occur. I can be surprised that I have no money in my bank account, but the figures make it certain that there is no money in my account however surprised I may be. So I can be surprised even it is something is certain. For I may not know it is certan.

@kennethamy,

kennethamy;160146 wrote:

In the trivial sense of "fate" in which sense it would be logically impossible for what is fated not to occur, fate is certain to occur. I can be surprised that I have no money in my bank account, but the figures make it certain that there is no money in my account however surprised I may be. So I can be surprised even it is something is certain. For I may not know it is certan.

Yes that's what i meant. kennethamy says it better.

@sometime sun,

Running does not help Dr Phil's of the World

@sometime sun,

sometime sun;160125 wrote:

Who said anything about being in possession of the rheumatisms of fate, just that fate will eventually destroy the joints.

The only unsuprising thing about fate is that we are all fated.

You dont have to know your existences fate to know fate exists.

How do you know all this?

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;160035 wrote:

Hmmm? Are you sure it's fate, and just not a bad habbit?

..and excatly what is this fate, if I may be so bold to ask?

trusting people who ultimately will deceive me...

i dont think it is a bad habit-maybe simple stupidity. or stubbornness? i keep wanting to believe in the bright side of things, the silver linings, and it seems as if i am doomed to the same experience. every time i think i am getting the right read, but never do. i hate to think i will miss out on the one golden nugget in the pile of crap...so i keep hoping.

maybe it is a curse rather than fate? voodoo hex?

@salima,

salima;160378 wrote:

trusting people who ultimately will deceive me...

i dont think it is a bad habit-maybe simple stupidity. or stubbornness? i keep wanting to believe in the bright side of things, the silver linings, and it seems as if i am doomed to the same experience. every time i think i am getting the right read, but never do. i hate to think i will miss out on the one golden nugget in the pile of crap...so i keep hoping.

maybe it is a curse rather than fate? voodoo hex?

No, Imo it's simple psycology, it lies in the instinct we are born with. Ducklings are pre-programmed to recognize the first big object they see, as their mother, and will follow that object and/or stay close to it. It has many times been documented how ducklings have followed humans around, because of that instinct.

Some humans are born with an inherent trust, some are born with an inherent skeptesism. Sometimes it's possible to "reporgram humans from such instincts".

Sometimes trusty people are swayed by emotional signals, such as smiles, tender words ..etc, and in the process forgets to look skeptically at the situation, the person's background and the minute signals.

Don't give up, it's possible to change.

@HexHammer,

HexHammer;160386 wrote:

No, Imo it's simple psycology, it lies in the instinct we are born with. Ducklings are pre-programmed to recognize the first big object they see, as their mother, and will follow that object and/or stay close to it. It has many times been documented how ducklings have followed humans around, because of that instinct.

Some humans are born with an inherent trust, some are born with an inherent skeptesism. Sometimes it's possible to "reporgram humans from such instincts".

Sometimes trusty people are swayed by emotional signals, such as smiles, tender words ..etc, and in the process forgets to look skeptically at the situation, the person's background and the minute signals.

Don't give up, it's possible to change.

it must be that 'bad boy' attraction.

@salima,

edit: moved to private messageing.

@HexHammer,

sometime sun;
Who said anything about being in possession of the rheumatisms of fate, just that fate will eventually destroy the joints.

The only unsuprising thing about fate is that we are all fated.

You dont have to know your existences fate to know fate exists.

HexHammer;160235 wrote:

How do you know all this?

Where did i learn this?
or
Why do i believe it?
or
What is it you believe?

I will answer all.
I learned it on the streets...... of time and fate.
Some things you are told, some things you discount or ignore, some things you learn or rate, some things you just know.

I believe it because it works and explains and could help other understand fate and their relationship to fate better.
It helps me be sure of myself by knowing it could help someone know themselves beter.

What is it that i believe and what information was it that led to understand this as a truth? Led to this understanding?
Life has done in me and i have done in life, things that must be unavoidable because there was no good reason for it, it accomplished absolutely nothing but a negative reaction and sittuation.
There is such a thing as fate beyond biology the theoretical fate i eluded to in the first post,
Theoretical fate is that which does not have to do with living to die, dying to live, it has to do with life and the experiences of life, the situational, the incidental, something we might like to call coincidental.
What the fates throw my way or i have flung at them.
There have been things that have happened in my life where there is something else over-riding pre-cognition, cognition and post-cognition, something have happened that have absolutely no regard of the past the present or the future, have nothing to do with the consequences, have no basis in of time.
They had to happen because there is absolutely no reason for them to be part of my or their life.

I must just reiterate fate has little if anything to do with time.

This may come out as Godly and as ecumenical logic.
But there have been things in my life that have absolutely no reason for being, absolutely no basis in reality, have absolutely nothing to do with me and nothing to do with choice or preference, absolutely nothing nothing to do with premonition and therefore nothing to do with being ready or willing or unsuprised.
Something can happen and we can see it coming, have no way to avoid it and still to this day after all of it still absolutely in denial and shock that these things happened.
But they did happen do happen and will happen, and everytime no matter how aware of their presence you will never be ready to believe them.

I hope this answers what you asked.

@sometime sun,

sometime sun

..it's sounds very supersticious to me. I can't bare to read anymore of your writings, I have to put you on ignore again.

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