Stupid people

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kennethamy
 
Reply Sat 30 Jan, 2010 06:48 am
@Pepijn Sweep,
Pepijn Sweep;123621 wrote:
In Dutch stupid and Mute have the same word for it. Creating new sybols or concepts like 0 and , raise only new problems. Old saying in Holland: to speak is worth silver, to be silent is worth gold.

Education helps only so much to make men less stupid. It all depends on the information presented. Noticing a Anglo-Saxon tradition by many of us, I question the neutrality of the arguments on this Forum.


In English "dumb" (synonym for "stupid") and "mute" also mean the same thing.

Education makes a person less ignorant, but if he is stupid, it will not help.
 
HexHammer
 
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 08:23 am
@Deckard,
Deckard;122056 wrote:
Why do most people believe that most people are stupid?

I think a lot of people include the above premise in the foundation of their belief system, their ethics, and their sense of self-worth. I'd like to take a poll but that feature is disabled. Do you think most people are stupid? I'll go against the grain and say: "No." However, I may be denial. I'm interested in hearing arguments from the other side. Does anyone have any proof? There are plenty of examples of stupidity but one example does not suggest that most people fit that example. So, if you provide evidence, please provide only evidence of the alleged wide spread stupidity of the majority and not specific examples of isolated stupidity.
It's when the "stupid" are not able to respond intelligently to the accuer's values.
Many civilized nations back in the days, have accued tribes of being stupid and uncivilized, just beacuse they didn't understand the civilized values.

In our own western societies we often accuse eachother for being stupid, where it's more like "unwilling to comply" that is the real factor.
 
Deckard
 
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 09:35 pm
@HexHammer,
HexHammer;140559 wrote:
It's when the "stupid" are not able to respond intelligently to the accuer's values.
Many civilized nations back in the days, have accued tribes of being stupid and uncivilized, just beacuse they didn't understand the civilized values.

In our own western societies we often accuse eachother for being stupid, where it's more like "unwilling to comply" that is the real factor.

If I recall correctly the word barbarian was an onomatopoeiatic contribution from the Greeks. Since the foreigners didn't speak Greek the Greeks considered there speech to be just meaningless sounds like "bah bah bah" which became babarian. (bah bah bah babarian...reminds me of a song... but truth be known I can't stand the Beach Boys.)

But as you pointed out it is not just a matter of just knowing the language, and knowing how the game is played it is also a matter of willingness to speak the language instead of some other language and the willingness to play the game by a certain set of rules. Either way the proverbial Greek will fail to make a distinction and simply dismiss all non-compliant outsiders as stupid barbarians babbling nonsense.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 10:56 pm
@Deckard,
Deckard;140791 wrote:
If I recall correctly the word barbarian was an onomatopoeiatic contribution from the Greeks. Since the foreigners didn't speak Greek the Greeks considered there speech to be just meaningless sounds like "bah bah bah" which became babarian. (bah bah bah babarian...reminds me of a song... but truth be known I can't stand the Beach Boys.)

But as you pointed out it is not just a matter of just knowing the language, and knowing how the game is played it is also a matter of willingness to speak the language instead of some other language and the willingness to play the game by a certain set of rules. Either way the proverbial Greek will fail to make a distinction and simply dismiss all non-compliant outsiders as stupid barbarians babbling nonsense.


Sometimes, it may happen that the certain set of rules by which the game is played, is also the best set of rules, and that the alternative set(s) of rules is/are, inferior. Indeed, it may even turn out that we are not even playing a game.
 
Deckard
 
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 11:15 pm
@kennethamy,
kennethamy;140800 wrote:
Sometimes, it may happen that the certain set of rules by which the game is played, is also the best set of rules, and that the alternative set(s) of rules is/are, inferior. Indeed, it may even turn out that we are not even playing a game.


I think Lyotard called them grand narratives.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 11:33 pm
@Deckard,
Deckard;140804 wrote:
I think Lyotard called them grand narratives.


Sorry, but that helps not at all. I would just say the same about them as I said about games. (Whatever grand narratives are).
 
Deckard
 
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 11:46 pm
@kennethamy,
kennethamy;140809 wrote:
Sorry, but that helps not at all. I would just say the same about them as I said about games. (Whatever grand narratives are).

Postmodern Condition is very readable. Lyotard is probably the most direct and understandable of the Frenchy postmoderns, not that I've read them all. Lyotard may be still a bit of a barbarian to you, as he is still, though to a lesser extent, to me. That said, Hume and Wittgenstein seem more barbaric to me than to you since I'm quite sure you've read more of their work than I.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Wed 17 Mar, 2010 11:52 pm
@Deckard,
Deckard;140813 wrote:
Postmodern Condition is very readable. Lyotard is probably the most direct and understandable of the Frenchy postmoderns, not that I've read them all.


Could be. And, if I had but world enough and time.....A lot of world, and a lot of time. It is against my religion to read French philosophers after Descartes (although, in Sartre's case I admit to have strayed).
 
Deckard
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 12:07 am
@kennethamy,
kennethamy;140814 wrote:
Could be. And, if I had but world enough and time.....A lot of world, and a lot of time. It is against my religion to read French philosophers after Descartes (although, in Sartre's case I admit to have strayed).


Limited time and an ever expanding world of knowledge gives rise to the need for the individual to specialize and The Tower of Babel falls perhaps someday to be rebuilt? There is rubbish to be cleared away but one must be careful not to throw away legitimate bricks...perhaps it is better to stack them neatly somewhere in the corner of ones mind; there is plenty of room for that, though our time is indeed limited.
 
platorepublic
 
Reply Fri 21 May, 2010 10:37 am
@Deckard,
Oh trust me, it depends on your environment. In mine, I feel like everyone is smarter.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Fri 21 May, 2010 12:52 pm
@platorepublic,
platorepublic;166967 wrote:
Oh trust me, it depends on your environment. In mine, I feel like everyone is smarter.


It is smart to be realistic.
 
 

 
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