What is life?

@Justin,

Justin wrote:

What is our life?

All definitions of 'life' seem to involve the illusion of 'motion'.
'Life', therefore, is an illusion, a fantasy born of Perspective. A magnificent illusion/fantasy, but not to be believed to be 'Reality'. Perhaps an individual (small 'r') 'reality' as per Perspective.
'Life' is a concept in Mind.

@nameless,

Quote:

All definitions of 'life' seem to involve the illusion of 'motion'.

How is motion an illusion? I've heard it said many times, but I don't remember a good explination.

@de Silentio,

de Silentio wrote:

How is motion an illusion? I've heard it said many times, but I don't remember a good explination.

I have touched upon some 'foundation' in previous posts.
There are so many angles that one can come from...
Perhaps you can run a search for "impossibility of motion", read the first 100 sites and we can discuss in an appropriate thread (if you like).

If you are of a mathematical bent, here is a 'simple' 'proof'; 'On the Impossibility of Motion'.
And here; Rebuttals to objections to impossibility of motion
Zeno's simple argument still stands, also.
Try; Physicists Who Know That Nothing Can Move in Spacetime

There is a beginning for your search. Some is rather intricate, some easier.. Good reading!

@nameless,

What is Life?

Life, is the Universe experiencing itself.

@de Silentio,

de Silentio wrote:

How is motion an illusion? I've heard it said many times, but I don't remember a good explination.

You mean in what way's could motion be seen as an illusion and in which way could it not be seen as an illusion?

@PoPpAScience,

PoPpAScience wrote:

What is Life?

Life, is the Universe experiencing itself.

What is Life? Just like Jazz. If you have to ask you will never know.

@Fido,

:)Life is experience, good, bad, indifferent or all the former.

@boagie,

boagie wrote:

:)Life is experience, good, bad, indifferent or all the former.

1% reality and 99% anticipation is more like it.

@PoPpAScience,

PoPpAScience wrote:

What is Life?

Life, is the Universe experiencing itself.

hi!

:)Like it!! life is consciousness struggling for survival.

@boagie,

boagie wrote:

hi!

:)Like it!! life is consciousness struggling for survival.

No. Life is your foot in a boot some one has used for a toilet.

@Fido,

Fido wrote:

No. Life is your foot in a boot some one has used for a toilet.

Fido,

Sounds hostile, was that the intent?

@boagie,

boagie wrote:

Fido,

Sounds hostile, was that the intent?

No. It just happened once, that a brother Ironworker with the whiskey ****s did his business in a Laborer's boot out of the judgement that he could not reach the privy. The Laborer, with other laborers sharing the shanty with the Ironworkers, had no illusion about who had plowed with his hefer, so to speak; and said: Only an Ironman could have done that. Great, able, and brave men often make the biggest *******s. But; that is life. That poor man was ahead by knowing who had done it to him, if even roughly so, because many of us are injured and never know where to target our fear or hatred. Thanks

@Fido,

Fido wrote:

No. It just happened once, that a brother Ironworker with the whiskey ****s did his business in a Laborer's boot out of the judgement that he could not reach the privy. The Laborer, with other laborers sharing the shanty with the Ironworkers, had no illusion about who had plowed with his hefer, so to speak; and said: Only an Ironman could have done that. Great, able, and brave men often make the biggest *******s. But; that is life. That poor man was ahead by knowing who had done it to him, if even roughly so, because many of us are injured and never know where to target our fear or hatred. Thanks

Well that is life from them, life tend's to work difrently for each person, some time's one persons struggles can be related to another's, yet each person would agree that the other dosnt truly understand how it feel's, and sometime's not.

Just have to think some, on what thing/person/proccess made there life like that, was it them self's or was to the people or nation's/goverment's and gave them a choice, starvation or join the herd and walk up that ramp of bs to the slaughter house, or to the milking pen's, then there are those that get to be free ranged cow's yet they are still bound by the wall's that man has laid out -.-' so how free are they really? how free are we?

well that's life for us, just short amount of choice's to live with, when you live in america, or on the earth it's self.

Wonder which people or thing's made us have to live like we do, those that drive to work everyday paying such high price's for gas/house/energy/food, just to be milked like a cow to drive the wheel of humanity around and around. Will that wheel ever stop?

I insure you, that you would find meany people with intention's to keep the wheel turning it as it is, for reason's of power, greed, lust, and idolistical posetion's, and those are the people that anyone could justly blame.

Yet america is very diverse, not all take the path of being milked, for there is a preferd cow that is milked, the other's lay in a state of false freedom, just to die in the end, and in the mean time, they live there life as they wish within the bounderies of the law laid down before they were born into the land. then there are the cow's that no one want's, they are the one's that dont fit the standerd's laid out before they were born,(aka sick cow's shot and not used for anything) so they are jailed, till they get better, and if they dont, they rot and die.

Personly it's those that are taken up that bs ramp into the slaughter house that get used the most, they get taken from just to feed it to everyone els, also can be seen as a false life, that dosnt fully squelch the thrist of the drinker, which will allway's desire more in life.

So to recap those that are milked are the higher elite class, those that are slaughterd are those that are mid range people that are taken advantage of, and there wealth will help power the wheel that turn's around and around, yet everything that they give, never come's back to them, for they get slaughterd, they just get taken from over and over. The free ranged cow's are the one's that just eat the grass, and injoy the life, and die in the end like everyone els.The nation's/law's/goverment's/armies would be the care taker's, that joined a system that try's to self presavier there way's of life, and enforcing other's to follow those way's/etc

Hope there is a place made where cow's can be deemed as holy entitie's, and be truly free, and no longer live where they are tricked into thinking that they are free, when they are pawn's\pupet's\slave's to the greater will of other's, that have intention's that are selfish, and main goal is self presaverance of there own point of view and perception of how life must be lived, and they seemly will protect there own point of view and perception of it to the death, and they will do anything to protect that and they would even destroy or enslave anyone that try's to stop them... yet they would not want such done onto them, yet they do it onto other's, for they do not follow the concept of do onto another as want done onto one's self, for if evey had and dose, life would squelch are thirst and we would never thrist again.

For that is life...for us that live in the present...For I did not make it as it is, for those that shared intent in such distaste full governing of other's are to blame...

So there is a war to be waged to win our world back, meany battle's lay ahead, and intill the war has won, or that enuf battle's have been won, the wheel will keep turning around and around till the earth's enviroment and people lay's in utter chaos and distruction physicaly and mentaly.

So this is true philosophy of a piece of life that some are faced to to carry every day. Injoy and stay happy and joyfull, share your thought's with respect and compation, with the same amount that you would want bared onto your own...equaly

@No0ne,

No0ne wrote:

Well that is life from them, life tend's to work difrently for each person, some time's one persons struggles can be related to another's, yet each person would agree that the other dosnt truly understand how it feel's, and sometime's not.

Just have to think some, on what thing/person/proccess made there life like that, was it them self's or was to the people or nation's/goverment's and gave them a choice, starvation or join the herd and walk up that ramp of bs to the slaughter house, or to the milking pen's, then there are those that get to be free ranged cow's yet they are still bound by the wall's that man has laid out -.-' so how free are they really? how free are we?

well that's life for us, just short amount of choice's to live with, when you live in america, or on the earth it's self.

Wonder which people or thing's made us have to live like we do, those that drive to work everyday paying such high price's for gas/house/energy/food, just to be milked like a cow to drive the wheel of humanity around and around. Will that wheel ever stop?

I insure you, that you would find meany people with intention's to keep the wheel turning it as it is, for reason's of power, greed, lust, and idolistical posetion's, and those are the people that anyone could justly blame.

Yet america is very diverse, not all take the path of being milked, for there is a preferd cow that is milked, the other's lay in a state of false freedom, just to die in the end, and in the mean time, they live there life as they wish within the bounderies of the law laid down before they were born into the land. then there are the cow's that no one want's, they are the one's that dont fit the standerd's laid out before they were born,(aka sick cow's shot and not used for anything) so they are jailed, till they get better, and if they dont, they rot and die.

Personly it's those that are taken up that bs ramp into the slaughter house that get used the most, they get taken from just to feed it to everyone els, also can be seen as a false life, that dosnt fully squelch the thrist of the drinker, which will allway's desire more in life.

So to recap those that are milked are the higher elite class, those that are slaughterd are those that are mid range people that are taken advantage of, and there wealth will help power the wheel that turn's around and around, yet everything that they give, never come's back to them, for they get slaughterd, they just get taken from over and over. The free ranged cow's are the one's that just eat the grass, and injoy the life, and die in the end like everyone els.The nation's/law's/goverment's/armies would be the care taker's, that joined a system that try's to self presavier there way's of life, and enforcing other's to follow those way's/etc

Hope there is a place made where cow's can be deemed as holy entitie's, and be truly free, and no longer live where they are tricked into thinking that they are free, when they are pawn's\pupet's\slave's to the greater will of other's, that have intention's that are selfish, and main goal is self presaverance of there own point of view and perception of how life must be lived, and they seemly will protect there own point of view and perception of it to the death, and they will do anything to protect that and they would even destroy or enslave anyone that try's to stop them... yet they would not want such done onto them, yet they do it onto other's, for they do not follow the concept of do onto another as want done onto one's self, for if evey had and dose, life would squelch are thirst and we would never thrist again.

For that is life...for us that live in the present...For I did not make it as it is, for those that shared intent in such distaste full governing of other's are to blame...

So there is a war to be waged to win our world back, meany battle's lay ahead, and intill the war has won, or that enuf battle's have been won, the wheel will keep turning around and around till the earth's enviroment and people lay's in utter chaos and distruction physicaly and mentaly.

So this is true philosophy of a piece of life that some are faced to to carry every day. Injoy and stay happy and joyfull, share your thought's with respect and compation, with the same amount that you would want bared onto your own...equaly

Well, you could say that life is a different thing for the old than for the young because the old value their lives more. But isn't that a little crazy too, to say that life, having a common name for all of us at least, that it would be different for each? Strange as it may seem, I lean that way, saying it is obvious life is what the living have in common, and yet, each can only know their own version of life, and so much so that we often see others as objects and not as equal beings.

@Fido,

Well yes there are meany way's to say what life is, yet you could break it down into two section's long, and short. The long one could go on and on never stoping till you have shared or portrayed every form of thing's that effect's life, or is apart of it.

Yet the short version is very simple, and to the point, yet meany time's it would never squelch the thirst of the person seeking the answer to what life is.

The short and sweet answer, is more like a guide for a person to find what life is from them. It's not so wise to let other's define what life mean's for you, for it's not there mind and life to define, because they could never see life in the same way as you see it, therefore it's mainly left for you to define it for your self, which in tern would squelch you thirst for an answer to such a question.( In short the best answer is the answer you make, therefore you can better relate it to your self, yet also in the proccess making it hard to fully share it in the same point of view and perception as you view it in, therefore it's hard to share one's own version of life if you make it hard share your point of view and perception of life it's self and the thing's within and not within it.)
to share your own version of life, it's best to share the thing's that led you to discover or find your version of life, therefore the other person could walk the same path, or take the same train of thought as you did, the trick is geting the person of the right track from the right station ^.^, the whole point is to get the other person to understand your point of view and perception of an idea or concept or a way of life, as seen through your eye's and not there own, yet the nexted step would be the other person giving it the same freedom and respect as there own, mainly due to the fact they would want the same done onto them, which in tern would make them equal's in a way. Which would follow to old saying every man was created equal, yet the key word is (was) for as time past, man had made man not equal. Mainly because the endless confict of action's and thought's that people dont agree with, mainly the one's that take away a person's freedom of movement peace of mind ,speach and some other's/ Rape murder and other thing's of that nature take away from such thing's there for it was the first conflict that arose, and was mainly defeated by the creation of a law, that applies to (everyone).

ya I kinda got off topic fast, to put it all back into perspective visit the link bellow, which mainly tell's the reason why life is what it is... it can also tell why the physical work's how it dose (like why must light be the color's it is) just subsitute the person saying it, as if the creator was saying it (god) and then subsitute the (it) in the same way as displayed in the example in the link, it's just a kinda like a tool, yet it dosnt fix all the problem's in are life's, yet it can close the book on a few asked question's, and help a person find a meaning to such thing's that would in tern bring peace to a chaotic mind, Only if one make's it be ^.^ anyway's thing's like this only have true meaning, if people see them in the correct way, or are even in the mood for such kind of entertainment like talk ^.^, well I hope such word's helped inspire you to find some form of thought that bring's peace to your mind.( I cut this post very short -.-')

http://www.philosophyforum.com/forum/new-member-forum/1055-meaning-life-4.html#post11819

@No0ne,

No0ne wrote:

Well yes there are meany way's to say what life is, yet you could break it down into two section's long, and short. The long one could go on and on never stoping till you have shared or portrayed every form of thing's that effect's life, or is apart of it.

Yet the short version is very simple, and to the point, yet meany time's it would never squelch the thirst of the person seeking the answer to what life is.

The short and sweet answer, is more like a guide for a person to find what life is from them. It's not so wise to let other's define what life mean's for you, for it's not there mind and life to define, because they could never see life in the same way as you see it, therefore it's mainly left for you to define it for your self, which in tern would squelch you thirst for an answer to such a question.( In short the best answer is the answer you make, therefore you can better relate it to your self, yet also in the proccess making it hard to fully share it in the same point of view and perception as you view it in, therefore it's hard to share one's own version of life if you make it hard share your point of view and perception of life it's self and the thing's within and not within it.)
to share your own version of life, it's best to share the thing's that led you to discover or find your version of life, therefore the other person could walk the same path, or take the same train of thought as you did, the trick is geting the person of the right track from the right station ^.^, the whole point is to get the other person to understand your point of view and perception of an idea or concept or a way of life, as seen through your eye's and not there own, yet the nexted step would be the other person giving it the same freedom and respect as there own, mainly due to the fact they would want the same done onto them, which in tern would make them equal's in a way. Which would follow to old saying every man was created equal, yet the key word is (was) for as time past, man had made man not equal. Mainly because the endless confict of action's and thought's that people dont agree with, mainly the one's that take away a person's freedom of movement peace of mind ,speach and some other's/ Rape murder and other thing's of that nature take away from such thing's there for it was the first conflict that arose, and was mainly defeated by the creation of a law, that applies to (everyone).

ya I kinda got off topic fast, to put it all back into perspective visit the link bellow, which mainly tell's the reason why life is what it is... it can also tell why the physical work's how it dose (like why must light be the color's it is) just subsitute the person saying it, as if the creator was saying it (god) and then subsitute the (it) in the same way as displayed in the example in the link, it's just a kinda like a tool, yet it dosnt fix all the problem's in are life's, yet it can close the book on a few asked question's, and help a person find a meaning to such thing's that would in tern bring peace to a chaotic mind, Only if one make's it be ^.^ anyway's thing's like this only have true meaning, if people see them in the correct way, or are even in the mood for such kind of entertainment like talk ^.^, well I hope such word's helped inspire you to find some form of thought that bring's peace to your mind.( I cut this post very short -.-')

http://www.philosophyforum.com/forum/new-member-forum/1055-meaning-life-4.html#post11819

Do you think if it were possible to view life through the eyes of a god, which is to say, immortality, that you could say that objectively, life is one thing, as it appears to be scientifically, all grown from the same seed? I think we can know that life is one thing, but that we all experience life differently, and give different values, which is to say, meanings, to our lives. In addition, our lives exist as realitites in time, and if it were possible to define our individual portion of life today, it would be equally essential to redefine our life tomorrow in relation to all changes of state in the mean time. The relation of happiness to life depends upon time to such an extent that we must all be old before we can judge our lives happy or not, and as we can see, the misery of age is so common because so often, people are over whelmed with regrets and lonliness which only death can cure. It is pointless to ask if the young are happy if they must face the devil of old age without a weapon, but that is our time, individualism alone in youth, and individuals lonely in age, yet, that is the reigning philosophy, and it rewards youth, and power as if these need reward, and before anyone knows better they are trapped alone in a misery of age, living life without meaning.

@NoAngst,

What is life? Well what is my life? Well well what is our life? What is the question again?
If we area asking for the definition of life, Aristotle gave a good definition of life is that which grows by, from with-in itself. Growth seems to be what is life. But growing for what? Growth by itself does not mean anything. In Aristotlean view life seems to be a way of perfection, a perfection that is dynamic. What is life? It is a question ask by someone rational, not by veggies or animals. So the meaning of life i'm seeking must be my own. To simply ask the question as if I can be satisfied with the answer is really begging the question. The one asking the question is growing the evolving process of life. To find the meaning of life seems not to end. Death? is it the terminus of life, the meaning, the end, the final act of perfection? No one in the history of philosophy (IMHO) has discussed death more meaningfully than Socrates in his Apologia (Plato's work though) but as we can see all that he say about it are conjectures, happy musing. But as Socrates say, no one must fear death, because we don't know it. We can muse about it but there is no point dwelling with it, what we have is life?
MY life or Our life? People will say that life has no meaning, because in the end, we will all die and everything seems to be pointless. but what about my life as a part of the whole "our" life as humans. We share our humanity with others. Our mere saying that life is meaningless is an unequivocal resolution that my life must have meaning for others, otherwise why utter it. My life touches others life. Contemporary existentialism dwells with this idea as a main point, from Marcel, Buber, Scheller and even the late JPII, that the meaning of the I dwells within the We. And the We does not only comprise the rational beings but the entire flotilla of beings, of everything. Life's meaning, can and must be found only within the ambit of everything.

@midas77,

midas77 wrote:

What is life? Well what is my life? Well well what is our life? What is the question again?
If we area asking for the definition of life, Aristotle gave a good definition of life is that which grows by, from with-in itself. Growth seems to be what is life. But growing for what? Growth by itself does not mean anything. In Aristotlean view life seems to be a way of perfection, a perfection that is dynamic. What is life? It is a question ask by someone rational, not by veggies or animals. So the meaning of life i'm seeking must be my own. To simply ask the question as if I can be satisfied with the answer is really begging the question. The one asking the question is growing the evolving process of life. To find the meaning of life seems not to end. Death? is it the terminus of life, the meaning, the end, the final act of perfection? No one in the history of philosophy (IMHO) has discussed death more meaningfully than Socrates in his Apologia (Plato's work though) but as we can see all that he say about it are conjectures, happy musing. But as Socrates say, no one must fear death, because we don't know it. We can muse about it but there is no point dwelling with it, what we have is life?
MY life or Our life? People will say that life has no meaning, because in the end, we will all die and everything seems to be pointless. but what about my life as a part of the whole "our" life as humans. We share our humanity with others. Our mere saying that life is meaningless is an unequivocal resolution that my life must have meaning for others, otherwise why utter it. My life touches others life. Contemporary existentialism dwells with this idea as a main point, from Marcel, Buber, Scheller and even the late JPII, that the meaning of the I dwells within the We. And the We does not only comprise the rational beings but the entire flotilla of beings, of everything. Life's meaning, can and must be found only within the ambit of everything.

Everyone must fear death because we don't know it. But don't we? Don't all living beings demonstrate an instinctual aversion to death? The reason we concoct explainations of reality after death is to allow for the risking of life and the pissing of it away on nothing. Those who know the most prize their lives beyond all measure of reason, and very often manipulate those who know the least into capturing a world they will never live to appreciate. If you think the meaning of the I dwells in the we, it is because all meaning is shared. All meaning, forms, concepts, and ideas are also forms of relationship. What would have meaning to the last person on earth? That person, if they knew the facts would realize their life was over. Meaning would lose its meaning. The fact is that while we experience life as individuals, that our existence depends upon both men and women together so, it is that unit, comprised of two which is the true individual.

@Fido,

Fido wrote:

Everyone must fear death because we don't know it. But don't we? Don't all living beings demonstrate an instinctual aversion to death? The reason we concoct explainations of reality after death is to allow for the risking of life and the pissing of it away on nothing.

yes that's it. Everything that we can say about death is a concoction, a make believe. we don't know it. We can know it only after we experience it or not experience it if that may be the case. Everything we know about death is connected with our life. Too much musing with death in life does not lead to anything. Are you suggesting a "promise of salvation?" What salvation? Save my life by death? Never heard anything so unreasonable.

Don't all living beings demonstrate an instinctual aversion to death? I think not. What living beings demonstrate is a primordial leaning to protect and cling to life, to perpetuate as far as it can do. Clinging to life does not necessary mean being averse to death. . Living beings as we observe had find ways to perpetuate life, even if an individual being died. Death is a fact of life one must accept. The experience of the moment of death is unknown, yes. The problem why most human fear death is because of its literal meaning, that life ceases to be. What if it is not the case? That death is but a treshold to a life more marvelous than we know. WOuld we not love death then because it opens the door? But we don't know really what death is, lets talk about life more then. And not be afraid of something we can not control.

@midas77,

midas,

:)You cannot have been to observant of the wilderness, forest, plains or tundra, wild life is always alert to the dangers of death, the lacks get quickly selected out of the gene pool. It is true consciousness cannot imagine not being conscious, but then, the dead cannot imagine being conscious.

:)The harshest fact of life is perhaps that life lives on life, we stay in being by consuming the lives of other beings. In other words, all life is food for the continuation of life, symbolically, the snake in a circle consuming his own tail, that is life's cycle. Knowledge of which popular culture and religion manage to ignore.

Smile

Life after death, if you are not talking of the following generation is pure fantasy, comfort for the faint of heart. It is a tuff reality to deal with, and I have no idea what makes the difference between people like myself who do not feel they can avoid the obvious, and those who tripout on these fantasies of no substance.

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