Who owns your soul?

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sometime sun
 
Reply Sat 5 Jun, 2010 07:30 pm
@Zetherin,
Zetherin;173614 wrote:

It seems whenever I point something out that someone doesn't like on this forum, it is considered an attack. I am not belittling or attacking you sometime, and I don't know why you think this.

It all depends on the vehicle,
I told you how much I liked the first post where you said you could not grasp me but that I blew your mind.
That was a nice way to put it.
But you persisted and the fact someone else was following this and agreeing for the same post but put in a slightly harsher tone each new version I think I am justified in feeling a little belittled.
You said it once in a a friendly manner I responded and welcomed your comment.
You persisted with the same comment but harsher and I made it clear I felt annoyed or hurt by your second version of this same 'constructive' criticism.

Oh and nice try, this is not the analysis of sometime suns soul, this is the analysis of soul analysis. You know it and I know it.

Thanks and full stop.

Who owns your soul?

---------- Post added 06-06-2010 at 02:33 AM ----------

I still love you though:)

---------- Post added 06-06-2010 at 02:38 AM ----------

Zetherin;173598 wrote:
The word salad we are seeing here is getting to be rather annoying, don't you think?

I don't understand this could you please explain?
 
Zetherin
 
Reply Sat 5 Jun, 2010 07:39 pm
@sometime sun,
sometime sun wrote:
Who owns your soul?


No one, because I don't have a soul.

Thanks and full stop Smile

I think it's better to include smileys in my writings from now on, that way people have less of a chance of taking offense. Look how amicable I appear now! Very Happy
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sat 5 Jun, 2010 07:45 pm
@Zetherin,
Zetherin;173568 wrote:
I think over the last ten pages you've noted that the soul is just about everything.

If I may ask, sometime sun, where are you looking to go with this thread?

I have questioned I have not decided.

What makes you think I am looking to go anywhere?
What makes you think I have any design or desire over it?

I ask questions so other can give me THEIR answers, not just so I can or not give mine.

Where am I looking to go with this thread?
Where ever YOU SHOW me.

(As long as not having to look to much at myself it would appear, my answer is boring it is yours that excites me)Smile

---------- Post added 06-06-2010 at 02:59 AM ----------

Zetherin;173637 wrote:
No one, because I don't have a soul.

Thanks and full stop Smile

I think it's better to include smileys in my writings from now on, that way people have less of a chance of taking offense. Look how amicable I appear now! Very Happy

Not offended, confused.

As said my humour is wired differently so yes if you are being jovial an indication of this is useful.

So you do not own a soul but do you value your definition of it enough to say it has no ownership?

---------- Post added 06-06-2010 at 03:08 AM ----------

HOW do you value your definition of ownership?
Is this done by dis-ownership?
Is your value a dis avowal?
What is your value worth?
 
prothero
 
Reply Sat 5 Jun, 2010 08:18 pm
@sometime sun,
Quote:
Who owns your soul?

You do of course, it is yours until you die.
Of course, the more basic question, is what is a soul? or is there such a thing as a soul?
It is hard to "own" something which is not described and may not exist.
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sat 5 Jun, 2010 08:18 pm
@sometime sun,
How do you, can you own your value?

---------- Post added 06-06-2010 at 03:20 AM ----------

prothero;173657 wrote:
You do of course, it is yours until you die.
Of course, the more basic question, is what is a soul? or is there such a thing as a soul?
It is hard to "own" something which is not described and may not exist.

Can you own a non existent?
 
Krumple
 
Reply Sat 5 Jun, 2010 09:05 pm
@sometime sun,
sometime sun;173658 wrote:
Can you own a non existent?


No. But if the soul doesn't exist then it is pointless to consider ownership.

Who owns the flying pink elephant?
 
wayne
 
Reply Sat 5 Jun, 2010 11:36 pm
@Minimal,
Minimal;173561 wrote:
The ownership I speak of is merely perceived possessiveness. Arguably, whatever you think you "possess" is an artificial construct based on this instinctive origin -- to have perceived relative control over our immediate surroundings. Maternal and paternal instinct to me seems to, generally, gravitate to the notion we hold a special possession of another, our offspring. Surely you must agree there is some degree of possession involved? This is not to say we treat children as chattel but we feel somehow obligated to respond to their needs and, sometimes, wants. It is our perceived problem. We have relative control over their behaviour and survival. Other species reflect this.

Ownership is just who has control over something; another being can have relative "ownership" over you. Sadly you are not as free as you might first hoped.

Regards,

Minimal.


Either I don't get it or you are expanding in circles. Suddenly possession is ownership, and responsibility is ownership too. Sounds like all I need to do is take possession of your car and I will own it.
How does perceived possessiveness translate to ownership?
Oppression and freedom are not related to ownership either, unless you are a slave, which I am not.
 
Zetherin
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 01:34 am
@sometime sun,
sometime sun wrote:
Can you own a non existent?


Try to answer this one for yourself. What do you think?

Can you own something that is non-existent?
 
apehead
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 09:05 am
@Zetherin,
Zetherin;173513 wrote:
But dreams do not equal reality, as dreams are imaginary, and reality is not.


I don't understand how anyone could definitively, objectively know that is truth.

Zetherin;173513 wrote:
So, once again, if everything is a dream, how do we distinguish what is real, from what is imaginary?


We don't. Usually, we rely on intrasubjective consensus to determine what is objectively real, or true. Of course, this method is still limited by factors, such as imperfect knowledge, bias and prejudice, etc. In my opinion, intrasubjective consensus is not adequate to determine truth, reality, or fact.



Zetherin;173513 wrote:
No. If you stick around long enough, you will realize that faith is not belief with justification. Perhaps I'll help express this to you in another thread.


"Faith - confidence or trust in a person or thing; belief that is not based on proof"

"Belief - something believed; an opinion or conviction; confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof"

"Just - guided by truth, reason, justice, and fairness"

They seem fairly similar to me.


Zetherin;173513 wrote:
Souls don't exist.


We don't know if they do or not.
 
Twirlip
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 09:27 am
@sometime sun,
sometime sun;173658 wrote:
How do you, can you own your value?

Have you been trying all along to ask the question whether you and your soul are the same entity, or whether on the other hand you and your soul are distinct entities, having some kind of relationship other than the relationship of simple logical identity? I'd say the latter.
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 01:29 pm
@Zetherin,
Zetherin;173743 wrote:
Try to answer this one for yourself. What do you think?

Can you own something that is non-existent?

I would like to say no, but I cant help thinking that non existent may own me.
(Does the non existence exist?)

And if you are still saying a soul does not exist we must go back again and figure out what constitutes existence.

How real is perception?

Soul does exist because it has a meaning and a description and a confinement called 'soul'.
Its matter and substance may not but its value does.

---------- Post added 06-06-2010 at 08:40 PM ----------

Twirlip;173812 wrote:
Have you been trying all along to ask the question whether you and your soul are the same entity, or whether on the other hand you and your soul are distinct entities, having some kind of relationship other than the relationship of simple logical identity? I'd say the latter.

Yes that is definitely in there with everything else that came up.

Are you here saying that the soul is illogical?
 
Twirlip
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 02:13 pm
@sometime sun,
sometime sun;173862 wrote:
Are you here saying that the soul is illogical?

No, not at all.

I tend to think of my soul as a small illuminated patch of something that is immortal. When the light goes out, what it illuminates will still be there. Other small patches of light overlap mine. It moves around, sometimes picking out this, sometimes picking out that. What is illuminated is never seen very clearly (not by me, at any rate), but it is there (probably). But no other little patch of light will ever illuminate exactly the same things as mine, which is why death is a real loss, and really to be feared and grieved over. Hear endeth the lesson, blah blah, yada yada la scala.
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 02:34 pm
@Twirlip,
Twirlip;173870 wrote:
No, not at all.

I tend to think of my soul as a small illuminated patch of something that is immortal. When the light goes out, what it illuminates will still be there. Other small patches of light overlap mine. It moves around, sometimes picking out this, sometimes picking out that. What is illuminated is never seen very clearly (not by me, at any rate), but it is there (probably). But no other little patch of light will ever illuminate exactly the same things as mine, which is why death is a real loss, and really to be feared and grieved over. Hear endeth the lesson, blah blah, yada yada la scala.

Beautifully put. The soul is a invisible visibility lazer show.
 
Dr Seuss
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 02:51 pm
@sometime sun,
I believe we (as in a living body) are the soul. Everything that breathes has a soul once it dies the soul i.e the living thing, extinguishes. Like an energy that starts decreasing until it ceases to exist. Like a candle that burns out.
 
Krumple
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 04:54 pm
@Dr Seuss,
Dr. Seuss;173881 wrote:
I believe we (as in a living body) are the soul. Everything that breathes has a soul once it dies the soul i.e the living thing, extinguishes. Like an energy that starts decreasing until it ceases to exist. Like a candle that burns out.


The only problem I have with this is, why call it a soul then? Why not just say there is life and when the functioning that supports life ceases to be, the organism dies? Why slap another word onto it which makes it even more confusing?
 
Dr Seuss
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 05:09 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple;173945 wrote:
The only problem I have with this is, why call it a soul then? Why not just say there is life and when the functioning that supports life ceases to be, the organism dies? Why slap another word onto it which makes it even more confusing?


That's a good question. The soul is life. But, since I wanted to give my view on what the 'soul' is if I don't use the word 'soul' in there then what purpose will my words have?
 
Krumple
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 05:23 pm
@Dr Seuss,
Dr. Seuss;173952 wrote:
That's a good question. The soul is life. But, since I wanted to give my view on what the 'soul' is if I don't use the word 'soul' in there then what purpose will my words have?


Okay fair enough, so for you life and soul are interchangeable? So all things living have or are souls? Plants, microorganisms, animals, ect all have or are souls?
 
reasoning logic
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 05:30 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple;173957 wrote:
Okay fair enough, so for you life and soul are interchangeable? So all things living have or are souls? Plants, microorganisms, animals, ect all have or are souls?


Yes if we define soul as biology. Smile
 
Krumple
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 05:39 pm
@reasoning logic,
reasoning logic;173959 wrote:
Yes if we define soul as biology. Smile


Well it just seems a little strange to even bring up the word soul then. Why not just stick with biology or life then? Because if you say soul then people might confuse that with either their own interpretation or some other invested concept. However if you just stick with biology or life then these words are much more understandable.

It just seems like adding on extra baggage that is unnecessary.
 
reasoning logic
 
Reply Sun 6 Jun, 2010 05:46 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple;173963 wrote:
Well it just seems a little strange to even bring up the word soul then. Why not just stick with biology or life then? Because if you say soul then people might confuse that with either their own interpretation or some other invested concept. However if you just stick with biology or life then these words are much more understandable.

It just seems like adding on extra baggage that is unnecessary.


I do think you are correct, I was just being sensitive to others that find an extreme value in the word soul, hoping that they will continue to read my point of views in the future. Smile
 
 

 
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