"Not thinking"

  1. Philosophy Forum
  2. » General Discussion
  3. » "Not thinking"

Get Email Updates Email this Topic Print this Page

Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 02:20 pm
Just some random thoughts.

Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching perfection?

In a sense that one has got to a certain point that everything can automatically be done without "thinking" about it.

Is not thinking - in actuality, virtually and practically an elevated form of thinking?

Action with minimal process time - Yet with accomplishment at your feet.

Unlocking the subconscious part of the brain.

I'm not sure if I'm making any sense with this. Just something on my mind lately.. Needs a bit more scrutiny and elaboration.

But if you get it or differ with it. A response would be much appreciated..

Cheers.
 
Pepijn Sweep
 
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 02:25 pm
@Infovore,
Infovore;127940 wrote:
Just some random thoughts.

Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching Unlocking the subconscious part of the brain.

A response would be much appreciated..

Cheers.


Do you mean with the sub-consciousness our (animal) reflexes and instincts?:detective:
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 02:26 pm
@Infovore,
Infovore;127940 wrote:
Just some random thoughts.

Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching perfection?



Yes. A perfect dummy. But, let me think about it.
 
Infovore
 
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 02:43 pm
@Infovore,
^Lol.

Nevermind then. Might have delivered the question wrong or it was just stupid. lol.

@ Sweep. Sort of that, but not entirely. But anyway...

Cheers.
 
William
 
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 03:37 pm
@Infovore,
Infovore;127940 wrote:
Just some random thoughts.
Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching perfection?


Yes. It's exactly that. To effort to think is a mechanism of survival giving license to 'thinking long, thinking wrong'. When what is right will come naturally without a second thought.

Infovore;127940 wrote:
In a sense that one has got to a certain point that everything can automatically be done without "thinking" about it.


Right, those who think the most are in arenas they shouldn't be and effort to acclimate in those arenas. Like having to study for an exam. If it is alien to you, you can remember it but unless you continue to burn the midnight oil you will lose it for it is not complimentary/complementary with all you have in memory and serves to cause confusion in what is the innate you.

Infovore;127940 wrote:
Is not thinking - in actuality, virtually and practically an elevated form of thinking?


No, it is you becoming you after erasing all imposed outside unessential................crap that you don't need.

Infovore;127940 wrote:
Action with minimal process time - Yet with accomplishment at your feet.


Right.

Infovore;127940 wrote:
Unlocking the subconscious part of the brain.


That's on way of putting it. Mind is more appropriate though. Allowing the mind to process information for you. It can do that easily if you don't encumber it with superfluous input. Unfortunately we are a long way from understanding what you are offering. If it doesn't fit don't try to make it fit for extraneous reasons. Maybe it will someday if you don't forget it. That's a sign. Don't press if it is uncomfortable to you now.


Infovore;127940 wrote:
I'm not sure if I'm making any sense with this. Just something on my mind lately.. Needs a bit more scrutiny and elaboration.


You are making good sense, to me; but for others who seem to think a lot it will be hard for them to understand. To them thinking is an erroneous talent who never make any sense and often find argument thrilling and accomplish nothing rewarding or fulfilling that is long lasting. They spend all their time thinking. Ha!


Infovore;127940 wrote:
But if you get it or differ with it. A response would be much appreciated..


I get it and because you got it one day you will too.


Infovore;127940 wrote:
Cheers.


Ditto.

William
 
Reconstructo
 
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 03:46 pm
@Infovore,
Infovore;127940 wrote:
Just some random thoughts.

Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching perfection?

In a sense that one has got to a certain point that everything can automatically be done without "thinking" about it.

Is not thinking - in actuality, virtually and practically an elevated form of thinking?

Action with minimal process time - Yet with accomplishment at your feet.

Unlocking the subconscious part of the brain.

I'm not sure if I'm making any sense with this. Just something on my mind lately.. Needs a bit more scrutiny and elaboration.

But if you get it or differ with it. A response would be much appreciated..

Cheers.


This reminds me of the Tao. A person could view thinking as the manifestation of unnecessary friction. I've heard that the best runners aim for a state of mind something like the one you are describing. Of course, I wouldn't push this perspective too far myself.
 
William
 
Reply Sat 13 Feb, 2010 04:38 pm
@Reconstructo,
Reconstructo;127964 wrote:
This reminds me of the Tao. A person could view thinking as the manifestation of unnecessary friction. I've heard that the best runners aim for a state of mind something like the one you are describing. Of course, I wouldn't push this perspective too far myself.


Agreed, we are a long way from understanding it and it will come naturally without effort. How long.....................? Good question!

William
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 01:09 am
@William,
Epitome, perfection; complete awareness, complete ignorance.

Does complete awareness or complete ignorance require thinking?
Whilst not being complete requires thought?
And as i have never reached completion (yet) I do not know what it is to not think.
How could you think about, be aware of, remember something that has no marker, has no way of being known?
How could you know you are knowing nothing?

Have i always understood what i think? Certainly not.

Can you control what you think? At least some of it and certainly direct it.

Try meditation, try not to think,
I have meditated,
I have never not thought, I dont think?
And if I have not thought (which really is certain) how could I ever know?

I dont know about the rest of the world, but i have gaps, in these gaps am i perfect, am i complete? of course not because i come back to thought, and quite frankly whilst i am alive and have this body to contend with i would be terrified to be without thought and at the least be in control of this nightmare of a life and body.
It can be a dream sometimes also, at least that is what i hope and work for. It is making the dream the most that is worth some effort of your thoughts directions. Making the dream your life is worth much thought.
Not all of it you are going to like.
Not all of it you are going to understand.
Unless this perfection state.

I have also been unconscious.
But this should be explored,
What is unconscious, ness?
It is something... you, your body still does stuff.
You are doing something always.
You are never not doing something.
Or are you and can never know it?
And until we die we need at least some of this time to be thoughtful.
You are just not always aware of the all you are doing and being.
You dont really need to be.
Which may lead to the 'complete' being total ignorance.
And this is also a good arguement for the self (soul) and body being seperable.
Imagine that if you will........ able to think outside of the body? Your thought being apart from your brain?

Subconscious is somewhere else that you have no complete awareness of.

Would you be closer to perfection if you could never forget?
Would you be closer to perfection if you could never remember?
I think a solid 'No' is the answer to these two questions.
Prove me wrong.

Do you think your subconscious?
Does your subconscious think you?
 
Infovore
 
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 02:56 am
@Infovore,
^Interesting perspective.

We use a certain percentage of our brain and it is that percentage that gives us a certain degree of awareness to our environment. Now with that said, our subconscious part of it is the unused part, accounting for the rest of it. Which is yet to be unlocked.

To reiterate what William added, "you becoming you" - meaning reaching 'full potential' as some would word it.

To quote Wegner:
"We act and behave in a certain way, using our unconscious side, before we think about what we are doing, using our conscious side."

Like Sweep also said, acting instinctively. Intuitionally, automatically ------ Sort of unforced energy and performance!

Not sure if you're getting me yet?

But from the very beginning of our lives we are channeled to do things in fixed doctrine. Do this in that way and it will work. Not refuting that by any means, however, being taught to dig with the limits of a primitive tool as opposed to being taught how to create it innovatively restricts progressive nature. Since it is by the same logic that other beings have been programmed to think, thus you too will become no better. Just opinion. Not saying it should not be guided though, just not too explicitly. Thats another topic on its own though.

Ag, I'm losing myself too. end of transmission. lol

Quote:

Would you be closer to perfection if you could never forget?
Would you be closer to perfection if you could never remember?
I think a solid 'No' is the answer to these two questions.
Prove me wrong.


1) Yes you would be closer to perfection if you could never forget. Cognitive learning theory.

Jean Piaget uses this to explain the process of learning. Not sure if he came up with the theory of constructivism?!

Nonetheless, he bases it on "constructing new knowledge from prior experiences" by the process of assimilating and accommodating information.
- Incorporating new experience/knowledge into a pre-existing structure of thought without changes to that structure.
- Adjusting your perception to fit new experiences.

2) No to the following question.

Quote:

Do you think your subconscious?
Does your subconscious think you?


You think your subconscious but your thinking would not exist without it as it is where pure thought (without definitive thinking) is constructed?

Hmm... Define thinking... Acting in accordance with reason... Which is extrinsinc..? Not thinking?!... Intrinsinc..? Regarded as not having any rationale behind it?!

Lol...

Losing myself again..

End of transmission until I get what I'm trying to say.. lol

Cheers.
 
Insty
 
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 03:03 am
@Infovore,
Infovore;127940 wrote:
Just some random thoughts.

Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching perfection?


I don't quite see it that way. But I do believe that there can be things that it is better not to question or think about too much.
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 03:33 am
@Infovore,
Yes i get you, not sure i find what i get all that important.Laughing
Dont worry i find you very important.

Take your time, thought often needs remembering directing, what i propose is that we also need to forget in order to learn, retain what is important over the calamity.Smile

Selective memory, selective thought ever possible?
Selective mind? selective self? selective being? Selective soul?

How much if not all of us is our memory?
Are we all what we have learned?
Are we not also what we dont yet know?

How much of us are we our thoughts already thought?
As much as what we have yet to think?

Perhaps we are all only our actions, whether they be actioned thoughts, thoughts actioned.
Can our actions ever be thoughtless?
Again are we our only thoughts or are we only actions?
Are we our we only our body, are we only our self?
Just so happening that our body is also our self or our self is also our body?
Perhaps niether one really exists?
Because being both they cannot be each?

What are we that is self and body, mind and brain, neither one because one cannot exist without the other?
We are a whole, not a mix of singularities.
What is that whole that is both but cannot be each because each can not survive alone? Even if pretending to be independant.
Unless my self/soul can leave my body? which i may only be pretending if i think that i can?
Have had some strange experiences though. No closer to understanding them completely but have had the experiences.
What is the word term we use to be the perfection, the whole, the completed?
'HUman being' i think they call us.
The vessal that holds both the body and soul together?
Is one more important than the other?
For one surly makes of the other.
 
Infovore
 
Reply Sun 14 Feb, 2010 03:41 am
@Infovore,
^Lol @ your first comment.

Anyway,

Quote:

How much if not all of us is our memory?
Are we all what we have learned?
Are we not also what we dont yet know?

How much of us are we our thoughts already thought?
As much as what we have yet to think?

Perhaps we are all only our actions, whether they be actioned thoughts, thoughts actioned.
Can our actions ever be thoughtless?
Again are we our only thoughts or are we only actions?


Intriguing questions. Thanks.
 
Flipside
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 06:42 am
@Infovore,
My current perspective is strongly aligned with William.

Thinking can pollute, confuse and impede the innate you (me, us).

Perhaps it depends on the style of thought, and tense of thought (past, present, future).
 
Scottydamion
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 07:53 am
@Infovore,
Infovore;127940 wrote:
Just some random thoughts.

Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching perfection?

In a sense that one has got to a certain point that everything can automatically be done without "thinking" about it.

Is not thinking - in actuality, virtually and practically an elevated form of thinking?

Action with minimal process time - Yet with accomplishment at your feet.

Unlocking the subconscious part of the brain.

I'm not sure if I'm making any sense with this. Just something on my mind lately.. Needs a bit more scrutiny and elaboration.

But if you get it or differ with it. A response would be much appreciated..

Cheers.


A possibly useful example would be that there is more brain function when you first learn to do something then when you repeat what you have learned. Playing a game for the first time involves much more brain activity than subsequent visits.
 
Zetherin
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 08:40 am
@Infovore,
Infovore wrote:

Can 'not thinking' be the epitome of what is defined as reaching perfection?


Please do not spread this. We need more people thinking, not less.

Quote:

In a sense that one has got to a certain point that everything can automatically be done without "thinking" about it.


Why are you using parentheses around "thinking"? What other use of "thinking" are you using?
 
Infovore
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 09:10 am
@Zetherin,
Zetherin;129316 wrote:
Please do not spread this. We need more people thinking, not less.



Why are you using parentheses around "thinking"? What other use of "thinking" are you using?


You're missing the entire point.

Example: You learn to ride a bicycle for your first time. The second time you pick it up, you get the hang of things a bit. Ultimately with more practice you eventually begin ride it without having to recall the process of getting from point A to B.

Now reference that to thinking. You have come to a point where you are having less challenge to actually put in any cognitive power into anything you do. Not that you're extremely smart, just that you have enough intelligence to get by.

Another example would be the job of a mechanic. After a couple of years - It gets repetitive when confronted with similar problems. Thus reaching a stage where work can be performed with minimal effort.

William and Scottydamions responses pretty much summed it up.
 
Zetherin
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 09:25 am
@Infovore,
Infovore wrote:
You're missing the entire point.

Example: You learn to ride a bicycle for your first time. The second time you pick it up, you get the hang of things a bit. Ultimately with more practice you eventually begin ride it without having to recall the process of getting from point A to B.


Yes, we can learn things through repitition. But you seem to be speaking more generally, not about anything in particular.

Quote:
Now reference that to thinking. You have come to a point where you are having less challenge to actually put in any cognitive power into anything you do. Not that you're extremely smart, just that you have enough intelligence to get by.


If you come to a point where you are being less challenged, then you should find something that challenges you. You shouldn't stop critically thinking altogether just because "you have enough intelligence to get by". That's just lazy. There is always something to be challenged by.
 
Infovore
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 09:31 am
@Infovore,
Ok, I get you.

Cheers.
 
Zetherin
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 09:38 am
@Infovore,
William wrote:

Right, those who think the most are in arenas they shouldn't be and effort to acclimate in those arenas. Like having to study for an exam. If it is alien to you, you can remember it but unless you continue to burn the midnight oil you will lose it for it is not complimentary/complementary with all you have in memory and serves to cause confusion in what is the innate you.


Those who think the most are in areas they shouldn't be?! :shocked:

:slap:
 
Scottydamion
 
Reply Wed 17 Feb, 2010 10:11 am
@Zetherin,
Zetherin;129324 wrote:
Yes, we can learn things through repitition. But you seem to be speaking more generally, not about anything in particular.



If you come to a point where you are being less challenged, then you should find something that challenges you. You shouldn't stop critically thinking altogether just because "you have enough intelligence to get by". That's just lazy. There is always something to be challenged by.


To respond specifically, if learning the correct way to learn makes it easier to learn, then there is still merit in this idea of thinking less. Laziness and efficiency are sometimes mistaken.
 
 

 
  1. Philosophy Forum
  2. » General Discussion
  3. » "Not thinking"
Copyright © 2024 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 03/01/2024 at 04:47:19