@William,
William;
Would help other people do the same.
No one man can possibly do that?
Be perfect or show it?
Living by example helps only to inform, it does not change any other they are that whom must take the journey in order to learn.
God is not just one thing, well sort of for the fact God is one everything.
The sum adds or delets to or from many things in the same oneness.
The sum of all things adds to zero, flight or landing, beginning or ending is zero, is God, whence all comes from and goes toward.
I think our estimations or experiences of this works darkness are different, you are speaking from a place of obstacle, where as i see this as shedding of all obstacle and trial, Divine light comes after the darkenss from whence it came and we all should be rather than be blinkered into false illuminations. You find your light in exposing the lies of darkness, St John is trying to say the same that darkness exposes the lies of light, or what would be light just as your darkness would be darkness but is not.
Lies yes, both, but we must find the truth which resides in life as darkness or the emptiness of untruth. To not be lied to or to lie is to be without truth in its many disguises.
I agree with you mostly about what you say because you are talking form a place where you say it is full of light, but what St John is saying is that this place is just as is empty of the lies for the light "raptures" of most is false and feels to be light. So it is darkness because it is without, the lie is absent, and what i think he is saying is that the only truth is with God which can only be prepared for by the waiting of death. We live in darkness so we can see when the true light comes.
Fear and misery are dark for they are places to hide, but you cannot hide in the dark for it is a place of being that no delusion can enter.
They feel dark therefore they are not the darkness encouraged here, for it is a place without the senses which is where most feeling comes from.
The senses being human and not Divine, which i am sure he has said we can only ready for not experience directly until we die and got God, are all God, because we have not been weighed down with senses and feelings which as human we distort or distorts us.
It is not a matter of shining to be recognised, it is dark so that we know the self first with out the blindings of others false light and dark fear such as you have spoken and such as fear of exposure.
You see first through you, and we only lie when we are not ourselves.
Misery abhors company in my experience, but this leads from you and from St John that my natural state may be to be miserable, because as i have said that one must be alone in the knowing of the self and yet i find that misery is worst when alone, for company is also when you cannot find your own light a good place no matter the lies of the companies light, to commune is to be able to see light that otherwise is not in your view.
I try not to be miserable, i do , which is one reason for doing this, to gain light so i can be happy alone, but it is still in my scrutiny a place where i will extinguish darkness not the place of dark i am still aiming for by my estimation of the place of truth preparation.
But as my life is preparation for light, burning away my rust, it is not as most the preparation for darkness. This does also sound sad that i am spending my life in preparation for my death, but it is in preparation for true eternity so i am not saddened.
Gotta do something with eternity.
But do you see that St john is trying to say to find light the truest of which is Divine one must be in the dark so as to recognise it when it comes?
He is in a way saying sensory deprevation is the way to reach for pure beginning or endings state. I could in turn say this is almost cowardly if not for the dangerous lies avoided, but to prove is to be tested. And if along my brave journey i meet and dance under bright satellites such as yourself all the better for the journey, but you are not the star of which i focus my orbit, so i can be a visitor to all but my self and eventually Gods love.
"not of yourselves. It is a gift. Lest any should boast"
This ays to me, not of self, the personality and pride therein is annihilated, the lies one gathers through ones life is shed. For with personality which is filled with false illuminations is gone, Lest any should boast.
Ahh the feminine of God.
A subject for later inquiry.
Meditation and dance is such as these good drugs you speak of and i would preach if i knew how i was able and to extol not just practice.
Rapture indeed if done without st Johns exposure of distorting flame in order to find useless dead weight for the soul.
But i am not viceless, although i do recognise and do battle with them.
I will quit smoking soon i have promised, and caffeine and fear.
It is with St John s depictions of weighty souls i find contrary to his exposition, but the weight could be time (inbetween beginnings end) with out age (childishnesses, senility). Hard to do as human but must bare the weight of our own creation, destruction.
The valley of the shadow is what i think St John truely is trying to describe, just without death as of yet, how must a man walk?
Rightly death is not to be feared, thereofre again the shadow is not warning, it is life, the valley of life toward death through darkness.
The righteous (though i should use such a word without the story) is the shadow and darkness correct that i understand St Johns turning over (flipping) of general meaning towards the dark.
'The dark is scary'. Could be the only incorrect usage is fear of fear, not fear of the dark, fear of the unknown, the unexperienced.
You cannot say that fear does not teach respect, if not retarded by the fear or the respect.
Story is not diversion, correctly used (such as in alot of Scripture), is the only mode (save experience which we turn into story), and take moral, the after school special stands up. Experience of the story example.
Just enough for all.
People find that taking is quicker than giving. Because they think they are running out of time rather than towards it.
Those who doubt you, may jhave their own quest in mind, and we do not so much learn form example as by self disproof.
Who is holding you back? wink
God cant not be with me, or you for that matter.
It is unnatural, possibly the only thing in nature that is truly unatural, to be without God, although St John inclines that nature is that which is to be defeated. Human nature.
I owe you a smile and a song.
---------- Post added 10-11-2009 at 04:12 AM ----------
Chapter 10;
'it has never realised, in fact, that it has had so much evil within itself. But now that they are to be driven forth and annihilated, these humors reveal themselves'
And now they are to be driven, still lack on how to do such, contemplation i suppose would be the answer, and concentration on God and the light yet to be shown, or the light that is all around and is yet to be recognised,realised.
A demon is only exorcisable when it is seen and believed to be against.
'These are the material upon which the fire of purgatory seizes; when that material is consumed there is naught else that can burn. So here, when the imperfections are consumed, the affliction of the soul ceases and its fruition remains,'
Burning the field to encourage new growth.
Dark night is the place where you can float when you have achieved this conflagration of the souls impurities. The soul is not yet at rest but ready for bed.
'the fire of love once again attacks that which has yet to be consumed and purified more inwardly. The suffering of the soul now becomes more intimate, subtle and spiritual, in proportion as the fire refines away the finer, mor eintimate and more spiritual imperfections, and those which are most deeply rooted in its inmost parts.'
Love is both the obstacle as well as the reward, love can be better, can be purer can be something to be relied upon to pass good judgement, but not before the inclinations of loves need to believe anything that offers heat is not purifed and refined. Love is working model of something we do not know how to reign and give bigger bursts of encouragements, educations.
Love is student, we are own teacher.
---------- Post added 10-11-2009 at 04:23 AM ----------
Chapter 11;
'for, as we say, the understanding is darkness, reminder of where we are'
Could not have put St Johns point better.
Reminder of the light light waiting where we are.
'and in all the affairs and matters that present themselves to it, it loves in many ways, and also desires and suffers in the desire in many ways, at all times in all places.'
You could take Williams point easily from this, fear of yourself and guilt of your love. But that is but a fraction of the debilities that unreigned love can wrought. We must know our selves and position to know our love the better.
But make no mistake love is of its self something alien and common in its uniquenest unquietness to each of the all of us.
'which afflicts it with its doubts and misgivings; and then by the love of God, which enkindles and stimulates it, and, with its loving wound, causes it wondrous fear.'
To experience is to fear perhaps, blowing out the water the need to fear not, it knows we do not have something therefore work the harder to achieve, or that we have something needed to be expunged.
We need to better our selves by recognising that there is part of us we dont want.
Fear can be motivator, even if it is just to be without, which is what the dark night is most surely, that place without. To be without may be the biggest best gift and prize worth fighting for from.
