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You know Salima,,,I'm trying to think about how it would be to exist just to exist.what kind of life would it be to just sit on your butt and stare at the stars? For me,,,happiness would include working. Creating. Producing. Being active in positive activities. If ya can't create,,,whats the point? Having someone to love and working together to create things. that would make living forever tolerable.
Would it really totally delete itself, or it would start and then crash and become corrupted?
Anyway, better give another analogy: A snake trying to swallow itself =)
I agree with that analogy, except I think its the mind itself that is the battery, not the body.
I think we can logically deduce that consciousness is not limited to the body though. My line of thinking is the following:
*The universe came to be once
*Everthing that comes to be once can come to be more times, thus, the universe is both infinite and never-ending.
*In an infinite universe, everthing happens
*If everthing happens, then minds are recycled. This is backed up by the second conclusion: If my mind was "assigned" to a living being once, it will be more times. That also means that it will last forever, and there are other minds like mine, though they can never be reconized.
maybe in a real biblical heaven we will also have the possibility of failure if that is what it takes to make us happy.
To put it another way since people tend to object to my line of reasoning and insist, "That a soul could exist just in a different dimension that is free from the laws of physics."
My argument for this is, why exist in two separate dimensions then? Why don't we exist in the same dimension then? It seems a little silly to have this sort of frail dimension on top of a "non-ending", "non-damaging" physics free dimension.
I think you can talk about such a dimension but the reality of such an existence defies all sort of rationality in my opinion.
---------- Post added 10-02-2009 at 06:48 PM ----------
But that defies the logical reasoning of heaven. What is it that is challenging? Are you saying people invent stuff in heaven? What is the point of having made a cell phone in heaven? The only thing you are talking about is some form of existence that is exactly like this existence but then what is different about it? Is there war, is there vindictiveness and corruption in heaven? Are there greedy corporation that patent their inventions? For some the challenge is to oppress others and to obtain more than everyone else, so does that exist in heaven too? I don't see where exactly you draw the line.
i think it is obvious that whoever is happy would like to live forever and whoever is not happy would just as soon die, the sooner the better. unless they are really optimistic they will be happy some day of course.
i wouldnt mind living forever if i could be happy forever. in fact i wouldnt mind dying tomorrow if i could just be happy today...actually i dont think i would mind dying tomorrow very much either way.
how come all you guys sound so happy?
You know Salima,,,I'm trying to think about how it would be to exist just to exist.what kind of life would it be to just sit on your butt and stare at the stars? For me,,,happiness would include working. Creating. Producing. Being active in positive activities. If ya can't create,,,whats the point? Having someone to love and working together to create things. that would make living forever tolerable.
Well the operating system would be cached into RAM and into a swap file so deleting the program wouldn't effect it from deleting itself. The only thing you couldn't do was access any function calls or the computer would halt.
I just can not see how any sort of "thing" could contain all memories, exist for ever and not require any sort of energy input to function. It just defies all sorts of logic and understanding.
My argument for this is, why exist in two separate dimensions then? Why don't we exist in the same dimension then? It seems a little silly to have this sort of frail dimension on top of a "non-ending", "non-damaging" physics free dimension.
I think you can talk about such a dimension but the reality of such an existence defies all sort of rationality in my opinion.
here is a guess of mine, pure speculation, and interpretation of various theories i have read:
the physics free dimension, that place where the source resides and from which we would originate (arriving here in this realm as mere reflections, you understand-not as entities or beings) is in fact boring nothingness from our point of view. we get bored rather easily. bliss would become boring very fast. but it doesnt matter because we wont exist there as we are here-we will be assimilated and annihilated into the original source being, of which we are only a condition. not only physics but rationality doesnt exist there.
now as to the question of why this one being that i envision, and why it came here where all this rotten stuff happens-my personal thought is that it was a natural consequence. maybe it happens better sometimes than others, who knows. and i also suspect that it cant quit once it has started. otherwise, if i was it-i would sasy 'ok, this one stinks, let's go back and try again'. either that, or that blissful happy place is so boring it thinks anything is better than that. now THAT is the scariest thought of all, as far as i am concerned.
now how did you let greedy corporation giants into heaven? they are in the other place...along with the war mongers.
i think it is obvious that whoever is happy would like to live forever and whoever is not happy would just as soon die, the sooner the better. unless they are really optimistic they will be happy some day of course.
i wouldnt mind living forever if i could be happy forever. in fact i wouldnt mind dying tomorrow if i could just be happy today...actually i dont think i would mind dying tomorrow very much either way.
how come all you guys sound so happy?
I think eventually immortality would drive most people insane. With only a finite amount of things to keep yourself preoccupied with, over an infinite amount of time would make almost everything boring eventually.
I would only like to have immortality with the provision that i could die if I chose to.
I think this is the whole point of life, the answer to the big question. From the moment we are born we have a time frame of about 60 years (if we`re lucky) to find a cure for death.
I really do think that science and medicine could eventually find a way for us to live forever; either by rejuvenating our bodies or by creating new ones and transferring our brain (not our memories,because that would just mean making a copy of ourselves).
If everyone on earth would contribute to the research i am sure that in a matter of 2-3 generations we would find a way to live forever.Maybe even 1 generation if meanwhile we find ways to prolong our lives.
Also i don`t think that if anyone on this earth would be put face to face with death, they would choose to end their lives, knowing that they can live more, experiencing new things, living a better life or reliving past experiences.
The whole "transfer your mind into a computer" thing is really troubling indeed. Wouldnt our idea of "self" still be tied to the body with just a copy of ourselves believing itself to be us on the other side? Wouldnt we still die?
I believe that if it were possible to create a brain and structure it identical to mine at a molecular level, each copied cell with the same properties, position, connection ,etc. that clone of mine would actually be me at that point.After having experienced something different than it would become another individual.
That's why if there were any transfer possible it should be of the whole brain. As someone said earlier it is a shame we can`t live longer and see what will happen...
What keeps the mind tied to the brain? Thats what troubles me.
Why do you think these are two different things? Isnt the mind just a product of your brain, the way your brain was taught to see and react to things? Sry if its a dumb question but i dont really believe in the idea of a soul.. i just think that any behavior including being good or bad can be explained (genetics+lived experiences=soul )
I have reservation about living forever,
I would not like to live in a hell like domain forever
I would like to live forever, in a place of love, joy and meaning and purpose absence of fear
I sadly disagree with you on your opinion. Say, if you really did turn insane. Would you really want to suffer forever inside the vast abyss of your own mind? Not being able to end the pain quickly? Not being able to sleep at night because of your raging brain... and not being able to stop it. Those who fear death do not realize what exactly death is. A numbing of the mind, an anesthetic. I am not suggesting you become suicidal, heavens no. But living forever disrupts the natural order of things and unbalances the way of Earth.
By the time you get to be 60 years old you're going to have so many memories floating in your head you will stop being able to think clearly so after a while it's just gonna be annoying, you won't know where you are anymore, where your memories stop and reality begins. The thought of growing old scares me. Live fast and die young.
I think if life was forever,in blissful and perfectness,not only would we get bored but we would figure out ways to end this endless life. I like pain,and suffer beacuse i'm sure as some could agree, creativity comes from it. So does joy,and love but... that's rare.
If we were living forever,noone would find the means to do those things they make a list of. '' the list of things i wanna do before i die'' and it would cause people to be less exciting.
On the other hand,it could go the completely other way and we can do,feel,touch and be everything we ever dreamt of! If that was so,would that be the cure to everything? Would a life where you get to do and see everything more valuable then the reality of what we are doing now?
isn't it fun when questions promote more questions? *big cheesy smile*