How can you interpret the statement: "I believe they're on a higher moral ground" to only pertain to dietary choice? Clearly, we're not just speaking of dietary choice, but rather the effects of dietary choice, and the judgment that follows (what's "good" or "bad" to do concerning these animals). If all we were speaking about was vegetarianism as a diet, and not as a "higher level view", would this thread even exist?

By adding the clause "with respect to dietary decisions". Given the fact that vegetarianism is a dietary decision, that we are speaking of the morality of dietary decisions should be obvious.

We are speaking of vegetarianism as a diet, a diet that is the "higher" moral perspective than the carnivorous or omnivorous perspective.

Thanks for everyone comments,

I draw a line with eyes. If an animal has eyes, then surely it sees. And if it sees then it thinks, and if it thinks then it knows, and if it knows then how could you kill it, gut it, skin it, pluck it, smoke it, boil it, baste it, bbq it, burn it, sauce it, season it, eat it, and make footballs and shoes out of the rest.

That line goes beyond eyes for me though, it is really a point of truth. A point of balance, of justice, equality, of freedom, not simply of all men, but more truly all things. That point is simply self-evedent, it is the Oneness of us all. That line or point of right, of good, the light, is the truth we've been searching for.
The truth that will set the lion free.

Try a vegetarian diet, it's the right healthy equitable true thing to do.

=
MJA

Day 7:

Humaneness is the equality of All, it's our truth, nature's truth, our salvation, our true destiny.
And many who don't see it, or have yet to be it have a long Way to go.
Be equal to All, be free.

=
MJA

Humaneness is the equality of All, it's our truth, nature's truth, our salvation, our true destiny.
And many who don't see it, or have yet to be it have a long Way to go.
Be equal to All, be free.

=
MJA

How much of this change could be attributed to conscious monitoring of your vitamin intake? Were you as nutrition-conscious with your previous meat diet?

I am sorry but you sound alot like those religous recruiters, trying to force thier views on others. If you have to force feed something to someone. You are either a trying to convience yourself through validation of others. Or it really doesn't taste that good.

I have no problems with people who want to be vegitarian. The issues I have is when the tell me that I am a bad person because I choose not to be.

The human bady needs a bunch of substances to substain a healthy state and alot of those are from meats. Each blood type requires a diet that will give the body what it needs. I spent a long time in the military as a RECON soldier. I needed alot of protien to make it through the day. It wasn't a jog around the park. We would run at least 12-14 miles a day with a work-out afterwards. One private decided to keep his vegi revolution, and wound up in the hospital for malnutrition.

So if for the rest of your life you are going to just run around the block and do your yoga. Then I am sure vegi is ok. OHH and my destiny is what I make it. If I have to kill to stay alive then so be it. Does that mean that I get any enjoyment out of it no. But let me tell you from a soldiers perspective. There are times when you have to kill. And if you never have that time then you are makeing someone else do it for you. If you live on this planet. Someone is dieing so you can live, and someone is killing so you can survive. The only true salvation is to get of this rock so no one has to kill for you and you no longer have to live. :poke-eye:

For the most part I was. I took different supliments but I took supliments none the less. I also paid close attention to what I ate. I like to keep track of things like that just in case I may need to know. That and it helps maintain health and immunity.




On a Side Note: MJA, I hate to say it but you really have no ground to stand on here. You seem to have a difficult time differentiating between what you believe and truth. This is a very dangerous trap that will end up getting you no where and certain remove any credibility you might have with your peers. I know this because I used to be this way. I would find what I thought to be truth and, without giving it a second thought, I accepted it as such. I have learned that there is no universal truth. Truth is something contained within each person. The more you try to unite everything, the more it falls apart.

In the book 7 Taoist Masters, a traditional Taoist text, it is pointed out that everyone has their own path to enlightenment. You cannot teach someone how to be enlightened. It comes with the trials of the Way (a path to enlightenment different for each person). Reading the Tao Te Ching is only the smallest portion of the Way and should not be taken as an understanding. After, if you think you understand the Tao then you do not (old Taoist proverb).

Your preaching on the way and unity and universal one ness and equality is not helping your cause because you do not have any substance behind it. Eloquence is no substitute for knowledge and no replacement for true understanding.

Having difficulty with the truth of equality are you, your not the only One. Perhaps One day you'll see the light too.

A quote for you savagemonk (nice name sounds like a contradiction to me):

"We are generally the better persuaded by the reasons we discover ourselves than by those given to us by others." Blaise Pascal

I'll wait for ya right here, at the light of truth.
And try a vegetarian diet, it's more healthy and equally right too!

=
MJA

Your truth my not necessarily be mine. That does not mean that both are not the truth. A belief is a fancy opinion

If you don't know the truth of equality, you don't know the truth.
My truth is equally Universal, is yours?

=
MJA

You are verging on word salad on par with double-speaking politicians, MJA.

It is fine to speak of truth, but remember that speaking of truth requires that you also speak of justification.

Justice is equality,
The truth is,

=
MJA

I suppose I could except a universal truth. The facts show that no one knows the truth we are merely dabbling in believes to find one. Until the truth of existence is revealed we only have opinions. If you are strong in yours that is great. Continue to study and find supporting evidence. With out facts there is no truth. And if you only have bits and pieces then it isn't fact. There are still to many variables to consider. I allow you to have your life experiment, all I ask is the same respect. If you feel this is the right path for you I encourage you to continue and present your findings. If you are going to stand in my path and try to force me to turn. I will run through you. If you would like to stop and have a conversation at the fork in the road. I would be delighted, but when I make my decision with or against you allow me to walk away.