this is a really interesting thread, i actually read the whole thing and it is amazing how it covers so many areas.

as to the original post, i wore makeup in high school because the girls i had the most in common with socially did and i wanted to fit in. i gave it up as soon as i got out of there and joined the adult working world, it seemed like a lot of trouble and expense for nothing. on the other hand, my mother until her death at the age of 81 applied makeup twice a day-personally i couldnt see that she looked any better for doing it, but i think she thought so and it gave her more confidence. however i also know that she was highly motivated to attract the opposite sex. she was raised in a convent boarding school and never went on a date until she was over 21 years old-go figure.

the other issue i would comment on would be that of equality. men and women are obviously not equal on all individual attributes, just as all men are not and all women are not. but men and women have struck a balance in every society which is a semblance of equality of influence, though from my vantage point it is really very sad. the situation in india is completely different from what i left in america as far as the relationship between the sexes, but every bit as unreal.

the lack of understanding between men and women is beyond even the already monumental lack of understanding of any one person and another. there is a level of being that goes beyond all differences, and if we as a species are able to realize that we will be able to relate to each other without conflict. i dont see any other way of truly understanding that we all-every human being-are truly equal, and yes that does bring the metaphysical aspect into the concept. without that perspective, i dont see how it can be resolved.

I love fashion and make-up, it's a way of expressing yourself and good fun too.

I agree with you Caroline, but sometimes, and this is probably because I'm a teenager, I feel the presure to wear make-up and nice clothes. Most of the time it's really fun though...

Oh yeah you're right Lily, I hate that. I'm totally natural at the moment at home.

Make-up = to cover up flaws.

I personally tend towards women that do not wear very much or any at all. I am not against the use, it's just I prefer the naturalist attitude.

To draw a parallel here, have you ever seen a person who wore glasses all the time, and then you catch them not wearing them and they look different to you? That is how I feel about make up. If they wear it too often, you get use to seeing them that way, that if you see them without, you start to feel something is wrong or off. Which is why I prefer a more natural look because then you never have such a moment.

I might be superficial but id rather take flaws than be off put. Besides isn't wearing make up in a way, a type of lying? Think about it. If it changes your appearance then you are not being honest to reality.

I think the point of make up is to be made up so you don't look like you're wearing a shed load, just to enhance the features so you don't look like you've been made up.

---------- Post added 05-30-2010 at 03:51 PM ----------

I'm definitely for the natural look as far a make up is concerned as opposed to lots of it.

I like this because I never connected the dots before, make up, made up, make believe, fantasy, fairy tale, fiction, made up.

I agree with this, I have read the first and last page concerning the issue and I believe that the length to which women go to be attractive is far too extreme. I understand that it is instinctively natural for women to not only want to look good to the opposite sex but also look good simply because it makes them feel good about them selves and also builds confidence and self esteem, but while these are all psychologically natural behaviors that I totally accept and find normal, what I really do not like and am really against is the extent to which it has been influenced.

Women are being influenced by modern society to a disgusting degree and it is ultimately women who are paying the price for it. Women are being basically disciplined by the media on what and how it is acceptable to look and behave like. These hollywood divas are the pinnacle standard for what is considered beauty and desirable,
they perform in they're videos and live shows dressed like strippers, and not only do they wear hardly any clothes but the way they behave move and dance is of a purely erotic nature! the message is basically oh look at me look how sexy I am you want me no? you want to do things to my body. It is absolutely disgusting and shameful that these people expose and disrespect them selves in order to get a few more dollars, but the even worst part is that with they're famous status they are no ordinary people, they are watched by billions of people all around the world, this is mass mind control, what you have to remember is that these stars are considered as idols and role models! they are what people look to and want to be, so what do you think is going to happen when these role models come out dressing and behaving in such a way? only the obvious, you can literally point to any epoch and point out exactly what trend and fashion the celebrities are putting forth simply by looking at the mass population of the current time, there has always been a direct link to what hollywood puts out to what is considered fashionable and acceptable amongst the population. Go to the mall here in Australia and all you will see girls wearing is skimpy dresses and skirts, ridiculously short shorts, body tight jeans and leggings, all these girls looking sexy and glam, yeah because that's the most important thing in life no?

The next point is women degradation. As I said earlier this culture that is being influenced on women ultimately results in them paying the price for it, which is a sad and immoral reality. Women every day are being treated with no respect and are considered as pure objects of desire and you really don't have to dig to deep to find out where this sway is coming from.
When Rhianna goes on stage wearing those skimpy outfits and protrudes her buttocks and moves her body and dances in a suggestive and explicitly erotic manner do you really think that she is promoting much self respect for her self and for all women? I think quite the opposite. I have seen girls crying explaining of how all men are jerks and that all they want to do is make out with them, and they carry on about how they are treated like a piece of meat, all while wearing ridiculously short dresses that display they're underwear when they lean forward 2 inches, I just think to my self like what do you expect I mean, I don't understand, its like a small lamb jumping in a pot and preparing itself with pepper and spices, and then it is surprised when it gets eaten. women need have more respect for them selves and stop depending on these celebrities to make up they're mind on what is considered beautiful and attractive, and that is another thing, there is a big difference between looking beautiful and attractive and titillating and erotic, I do not need to see your underwear to think you are beautiful. I was at work one day and this girl walked in, she was wearing jeans and a casual jacket and had maybe the slightest of make up (maybe non), she was one of the most beautiful things I have ever seen! she looked natural and simple, she looked like herself, she looked beautiful.

My next point is by far the most disgustingly immoral and one that sometimes even angers me. This disgusting trend of erotic adult "entertainment" in hollywood is being introduced and passed through as normal and acceptable, and as if this were not bad enough it is presented every day in day time television! children watch these MTV videos of woman role models dressed and dancing like stripers! What is this world coming to?!? tv shows that are openly within the time of viewing of children openly refer to and talk about sex and what guys want, it is sick! young children are being exposed to sex and adult behavior at younger and younger ages. It is common now to see 11-12 year olds out in public dressed like women! wearing revealing, short, body tight dresses and make up, these young girls are dressing like 20 year old strumpets! by 13-14 most of these girls have already had sex! O this society sickens me! I cannot keep thinking about this. move on.

Beauty. Girls wearing dress/shirts with no pants would come up and talk to me with 2 kilograms of icing on they're face and I just think please woman cover up its obscene! how can I consider attractive a girl who has such little respect for herself as to go out in public dressed like a prostitute? all that I see from this is immaturity and ignorance, not beauty. Personally I don't find myself attracted to girls physically, my friends even suspect me of being homosexual, what I consider beautiful is a girl that is down to Earth, respectful of her self and others, mature, things like that. And physically I find much more attractive a girl who is comfortable and confident of what she is without having to wear 10 kilos of make up on her face, natural look is beautiful. But for me the most beautiful aspect of a girl would be her over all personality.

EDITED/

You might well have stopped right there.

Hi All,

I am lucky enough to work in an environment that encompasses the entire divide of persons and personalities - A perfect view of the psychological values of each and every trait in each and every genre and culture.
Make-up is not a "Woman" thing, most young lads express themselves in a similar fashion - Their make-up tends to be in the way they project themselves (hairstyle, strut, loudness, gadgets and car choice). In older men - A style of maturity is projected in similar but, seemingly, more mature choices.

The older woman and man are typically obsessed with their appearances because they age physically and can't seem to deal with the absence of youthlike features.

Ultimately, there are many reasons for wearing a mask to cover or disguise the real YOU - But, it all boils down to one factor...and one factor alone - Self-esteem. The more make-up - the less self-esteem.

When you next gaze at a heavily made-up person, spare a thought for their sadness, and try not to point the obvious out - It makes them paranoid - and NEVER helps.

Those of you who wear no make-up, jewellery, fashionable hairstyle, fancy linen - who don't drive a flash car, display ornaments and show off your possesions and intellect - Who don't indulge in aesthetic enhancement - - - Welcome to the real world!

"Come as you are, or come not at all" All that is made-up IS A LIE, an exaggeration of the truth, and merely promotes a false reality.

Thank you, and have a lovely day, each and all.

Mark...

I really have no objection to young women wearing make-up just as long as they do not wear anything else, on the ground that wearing both make-up and clothes is overdoing it.

What about men wearing make-up? What that all about?
And I am not just talking about drag queens.

Not to break the topic completely up, but I think people should be allowed to do what ever the hell they want as long as it's not suppressing anyone else's ability to do what they want to do. So as long as you aren't causing physical harm to someone else or to their property, it shouldn't matter what they are doing with their body. Make up or not it shouldn't matter.

I agree totally, I was once known to wear the kol and nail paint, I drew the line at lipstick though, and I do still when down put on face paints.

interesting reading

Some suggest women wear make up for other women, not men. Not all women are looking for someone, for starters, so that explanation can go out the window. I don't wear much, and sometimes go without, but when I do wear it, it's definitely because that's the look I want, so it's for me. For example, you're dressing up to go somewhere fancy - a little eye make up finishes the look. Or maybe I'm feeling pale, so on goes some blush. Simple as that.

Make up is no different that women straightening or curling, or otherwise altering their hair (another thing I can't be bothered to do) or wearing jewellery or a push up bra with a certain dress or top - it just looks better. Same with stockings - a fancy dress or upscale work outfit just wouldn't look the same with bare legs. You wouldn't be able to definitively say women are doing all these things to get or impress a man; some of us have men, some of us don't want one.

Sometimes there's too much analysis about simple things, such as this.

I have never understood men who don't want their woman to wear make-up. Do they really believe the words that they say "I like the way you look better with-out it"? or are they trying to make sure that their woman does not attract the attention of other men?

Me, I want her to look hot and I want everyone to notice that a hot woman chose me.

One thing is for sure, men usually care a lot one way or the other about make-up, though often they don't admit it.

I agree.

My 96 year old mother will not leave the house unless she is fully made up--foundation, eyeliner, mascara, blush, lipstick--the works. And she is very careful in applying it so she doesn't look too made up.

She simply wants to look good, look her best. And she feels makeup helps to accomplish that, and I agree with her. I look much better with makeup, and, when I feel I look good, I am more self confident. I also think that at least a little makeup helps one look more polished and better groomed. If I'm just running out to the supermarket, I'll wear at least a little makeup, and, if I'm going to work, I will get fully made-up because I do want to project a certain image.

If anything, I think women generally dress and use makeup more for other women than to impress or attract men. A man may look at a woman and simply think she looks attractive or sexy, without necessarily reacting to any of the details about makeup, hair, or her attire. Women are much more likely to look each other over much more carefully and critically and to notice the details.

Sure, there are times all women will dress in a way specifically designed to attract or please a man. But, for most of us, this is hardly all the time, and, as we age, it's probably less of the time. Most of the time we just want to look good, and appropriate to the situation we are in.

And, besides all that, I find fashion and makeup and hairstyles fun. They are creative forms of self expression. I enjoy putting my external persona together and altering it to fit the situation, or my mood.