Catching bulls.

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Reply Tue 18 Nov, 2008 09:29 am
 
jgweed
 
Reply Tue 18 Nov, 2008 10:45 am
@Catchabula,
Welcome to the Philosophy Forum, and once you make one reply to a post, you will be an official card-carrying Member. It isn't green, however, because no one can define what a colour IS!
Cheers,
John
 
xris
 
Reply Tue 18 Nov, 2008 01:16 pm
@jgweed,
Belgium the home of my father in ww2 while fighting the hun..i do hope you enjoy your stay here, im an amateur so i will welcome your learning..
 
sarek
 
Reply Tue 18 Nov, 2008 01:54 pm
@Catchabula,
Welcome to the forum, my dear neighbour to the south.
 
Catchabula
 
Reply Tue 18 Nov, 2008 04:52 pm
@Catchabula,
Warm thanks for your welcome. So one cannot define what a colour IS (significant caps)? This provokes in me an old reflex: "De gustibus et coloribus non est disputandum". Now of course the young will make of that: "De omnibus est disputandum, etiam de coloribus". Latin... I never understood why it is polite not to use it in a conversation, the gibberish of informatics being tolerated without a problem. The existence of colours, that's an oldie too is if remember well. What to say about that? Let me answer with Russell's opinion on the mind-body problem: I don't mind so I don't bother! What playful coward invented it in the first place? Perhaps some Greek, discussing in the shadow of the bouleuterion while his wife was nursing the kids and his slaves did all the work? Put in a more decent form: this is not my central preoccupation. I'm dying and so are we all, and my tumor hearts like hell. So let's drop the bull and read some Kierkegaard or Dostojewski, and leave the futilities to the gods. Can you even imagine a god philosophising? Philosophy is for humans and is a serious matter.
 
nameless
 
Reply Wed 19 Nov, 2008 01:57 am
@Catchabula,
Catchabula;33970 wrote:
"De gustibus et coloribus non est disputandum"...
"De omnibus est disputandum, etiam de coloribus". Latin...

I think that I'm not the only person here not fluent in dead languages.
I would hope that if you ever wish to say something that you consider of value, in Latin, that you would provide, also, the courtesy of translation.
'Latin' is no longer a sign of a 'superior' education.

"In Silentium, Verum!" ("In Silence, Truth!") -Book of Fudd (1:1)

I translated that into Latin so it would sound cool and thus have meaning to pedantic elitists (trying to reach a larger demographic dispersion). I'm speaking in generality, obviously, nothing personal intended.
Welcome
Peace
 
Catchabula
 
Reply Wed 19 Nov, 2008 07:54 am
@nameless,
 
jgweed
 
Reply Wed 19 Nov, 2008 09:37 am
@Catchabula,
I seldom find foreign words or phrases in the forums that are not easily understood with the help of a philosophical dictionary or a quick trip to Google. It is in the nature of philosophers to use often common words in very specialised ways: Heidegger's Dasein, or Sartre's pour soi. So,too, with such phrases as cogito, ergo sum, or de gustibus non disputantur. These and similar examples are simply a part of the philosophical vocabulary which one learns in time.

It is a common courtesy, not to mention accepted practice in philosophic discourse and argumentation, to cite the original source so that anyone could both check to see that quotation was accurate and not taken out of context or important qualifications omitted, as well as read it within the context of a larger part of the work itself. Sometimes it may point the reader to a more complete discussion and in so doing encourage further reading.

Surely dismissing either as elitist or mere pedantry is to deny oneself the opportunity of increasing one's own knowledge and perspectives.
 
nameless
 
Reply Wed 19 Nov, 2008 10:26 pm
@Catchabula,
Catchabula;34039 wrote:
I honestly agree, Nameless...
Let's have a beer and continue this elsewhere... ;-)

I could have figured it out in a few seconds, but felt that I was speaking for the unwashed lurkers and the working-man everywhere that might have benefitted...
There are many phrases in the english language derived from other languages; you needn't feel constrained to translate lingua franca or cul de sac or pasta fa zool or kindergarten or fo shizzle, for that matter, but entire quotes in other than the lingua franca would seem to be more effective with a curtesy translation (fer us hillbillies). I didn't even know if I wanted to look it up. There's a lot of intellishit out there. And I didn't accuse you personally of any particular motive. I figured that you just neglected to translate, period, and was speaking in general.
Ferget it, it's really not that important.
My kinda guy!
Got a 'Becks'?

Quote:
Perhaps in quoting the book of Fudd you should also have given some bibliographic information, the major commentaries, perhaps even the LC- or ISBN-number ( I'd like to buy the book, it seems to contain good stuff ;-) )

Thank you for the kind words. You are reading it (as I write it)! It's free for the reading and will be netted in it's entirety, again for free. I find 'free' seems to attract a larger demographic. *__-

Now, about the Becks?

Peace
 
nameless
 
Reply Wed 19 Nov, 2008 10:29 pm
@jgweed,
jgweed;34055 wrote:
I seldom find ... knowledge and perspectives.

My hero!
(a mere 'thank you' seemed insufficient)
*__-
 
Catchabula
 
Reply Thu 20 Nov, 2008 02:50 am
@Catchabula,
Beck's?? Why not Hei... ? My dear Nameless, I live in Belgium, and the beers over here are like nectars, elixirs, magic potions, often being brewed by monks who pour in their spirituality and even a bit of the Divine ("To Theion": that's greek, and irrelevant ;-) ). So what could be more fit for a philosopher's palate? One simply does not escape becoming a philosopher here ;-) . Nay, nay, no more! Just a little rhetorical trick... I could have said a few words about the old hypothesis that the boundaries of our language determine the boundaries of our worldview (so the more languages at your disposal, the better), I could have stated that some words are intranslatable as well as indispensable (each word in each language being both a challenge and a tool), I could have mentioned that many accepted english words are latin or greek for 95 to 100 % (take "philosophy": now that's a word that needs translation!), I could have pointed to the explorative value of each really individual language (Finnegan's Wake uses 17 different languages or so; do you want it translated in english?). But I will not!! (Etc. etc. One has to use that trick three or four times over, and imagine it all said in the Curia or at the Rostrum. Maybe that's why Caesar was stabbed? ;-) ). Anyway, let's get out of this thread with whatever we are discussing, the beer may be the only valuable idea in it. Is there some thread on Tolerance here? I have to find out...

Post Scriptum. This eager beaver here just discovered the interesting thread on the philosophy of language (and vice versa). So not a word (!) anymore about language in this place. Hey, I have to check out what "fo shizzle" means? That must be american and I'm only acquainted a bit with english. I feel it as a bit weird that this kind of words is even considered as a foreign language (whatever the expression means it has a New-Yorkian flavour). Ah, the States, they are indeed the Empire in the Middle, or at least they feel like that, a bit like ancient China. Oh well, back to the First Folio. I'm not an orator after all, but I know Nameless is an honourable man... ;-)
 
nameless
 
Reply Fri 21 Nov, 2008 03:44 pm
@Catchabula,
Catchabula wrote:
Beck's?? Why not Hei... ? My dear Nameless, I live in Belgium, and the beers over here are like nectars, elixirs, magic potions, often being brewed by monks who pour in their spirituality and even a bit of the Divine ("To Theion": that's greek, and irrelevant ;-) ). So what could be more fit for a philosopher's palate? One simply does not escape becoming a philosopher here ;-) . Nay, nay, no more! Just a little rhetorical trick...

Belgian beers are delicious. Heini it is then.
Actually, if I had my choice, at the moment, I love the 'rawness of flavor', the bitterness, the bite of a Polish beer; 'Krakus', if memory serves. I have no loyalty to other than taste, unless someone offers it free, in which case I'm ready and willing to 'recalibrate' (to a point)! *__-
We have many tasty locally brewed beers (and 'microbrews') here in Northern California.


Catchabula wrote:
I could have said a few words about the old hypothesis that the boundaries of our language determine the boundaries of our worldview (so the more languages at your disposal, the better),
And I wouldn't necessarily disagree.

Catchabula wrote:
I could have stated that some words are intranslatable as well as indispensable (each word in each language being both a challenge and a tool),
Yes. Different Perspectives...

Catchabula wrote:
I could have mentioned that many accepted english words are latin or greek for 95 to 100 % (take "philosophy": now that's a word that needs translation!), I could have pointed to the explorative value of each really individual language (Finnegan's Wake uses 17 different languages or so; do you want it translated in english?).
Wouldn't disagree with this either. There are 'larger' ('wider' included angle) Perspectives and narrower ones.

Catchabula wrote:
Anyway, let's get out of this thread with whatever we are discussing, the beer may be the only valuable idea in it.
No disagreement there either.

Catchabula wrote:
Is there some thread on Tolerance here? I have to find out...
I'm sure that there is somewhere, but if you want to start one afresh, I'll be happy to add some ... Perspective. 'Tolerance' has varied definitions...

Catchabula wrote:
I have to check out what "fo shizzle" means? That must be american and I'm only acquainted a bit with english. I feel it as a bit weird that this kind of words is even considered as a foreign language (whatever the expression means it has a New-Yorkian flavour).
Local pop-culture jargon for an affirmative confirmation/exclamation. I included it as an archetype, a 'fill-in-your-own-blank-here-with-whatever-has-meaning-to-you-because-it-still-holds' type of thing. Not to worry, it'll be gone tomorrow.

Catchabula wrote:
Ah, the States, they are indeed the Empire in the Middle, or at least they feel like that, a bit like ancient China.
Very, very accurate analogy! We (all) stand on the verge of a golden age of Consciousness! A quantum leap!

Catchabula wrote:
but I know Nameless is an honourable man... ;-)
'Honor' is in the eye of the beholder, eh?
Peace
 
 

 
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