Time and space can never end. It is infinite.

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Reply Thu 11 Sep, 2008 07:24 pm
Time and space is continuous and can never end. Nor could it have a beginning to it.

Some people believe that in order to have been created we would not have needed time or space.

We would have needed time and space in order for us to have been created.
If someone was to say that if humans did not exist or that you yourself did not exist then there would no longer be such thing as time and space. They are right in the sence that since they are dead they are no longer able to perceive time and space. You need to exist in order to do so.

They are wrong though because time and space can never end in existence. It cannot be changed or influence because it is something that is just there.

How would humans have been created if it wasn't for time and space.
If you don't believe that there was time and space in existence before we were created then a god would of had to create us, because in our minds god is all powerful. He could influence time and space.

That ofcourse is impossible because time and space is infinint in existence. Not even god could influence or change space and time in existence.

The way that I would think of god if I was to believe in god would be that the idea of god is the transition from nothingness (possibly even time and space) to an existence. That would be gods one and only purpose.
 
Holiday20310401
 
Reply Thu 11 Sep, 2008 07:52 pm
@astrotheological,
This is something that took me a while to get used to. When I ranted off I would be corrected on making assumptions I didn't realize were such, just common sense. But they are misconceptions generated through the sense of what is proper as opposed to what has proof.

Time and space can never end in existence? Is this proper or logical? Though both don't convey truth, the logical scenario is about supporting opinions, whereas what is proper is intuitively motivated, and inaccurate, like it came out of a random yet absolute reference in the mind.

And why can't space and time be changed and influenced? According to Einstein spacetime can be bent but not ripped, but nevertheless, it can be influenced. (if you believe in relativity)
 
astrotheological
 
Reply Thu 11 Sep, 2008 08:04 pm
@Holiday20310401,
I would have to research on Einstein theory of relativity to understand what your saying. Why do you always try to disagree with my opinions and go to your best efforts to find excuses to say that I'm wrong.
 
Holiday20310401
 
Reply Thu 11 Sep, 2008 08:08 pm
@astrotheological,
I'm not trying to, it just happens that I disagree with your opinions. I`m just providing insights.

You won`t need to understand the theory, just pretend that spacetime is like a fabric; can be bent, but not ripped, telling you something about the fabric. As Zetetic said, (and since time is linked to space) time is infinitely dense.
 
Aesculapius
 
Reply Wed 22 Oct, 2008 04:17 pm
@Holiday20310401,
Personally, I don't believe in God. Therefore, I don't think that God was ever the one to create us.
I do, however agree on time and space being infinite. I don't believe it ever had a beginning or will ever have an ending.

As astrotheological said, it's just there. We can't influence anything that happens, but I think it is possible to bend it in a way that can work to our advantage (relativity). Even so, bending it wouldn't change anything, would it? It would only change how we see things. For all we know, nothing will have changed.

Influencing and bending time and space are completely different in my opinion, and so, I think agree with what you both have to say.

Aesculapius
 
MITech
 
Reply Wed 22 Oct, 2008 04:23 pm
@Aesculapius,
I a gree with astrotheological and Aesculapius. How can time ever stop. Unless there is a physics major who can explain it to me than I'm sticking with the fact that time and space is infininte.
 
xris
 
Reply Thu 23 Oct, 2008 05:45 am
@MITech,
cosmology tells us that time started with the big bang..there is no evidence of a before...There is also a none placewhere time and space does not exist.
 
MITech
 
Reply Thu 23 Oct, 2008 12:40 pm
@xris,
Yes but there would have had to of been time before the big bang would of happened, right.
 
xris
 
Reply Fri 24 Oct, 2008 03:08 am
@MITech,
Why should there?
 
MITech
 
Reply Sun 26 Oct, 2008 12:55 pm
@xris,
Because time is continuous. You can't just stop time. We shouldn't look at time as something more so we should look at it as something that is just there.
 
invulnerable23
 
Reply Sun 26 Oct, 2008 01:53 pm
@astrotheological,
And what is time? Your definition of what it is influences, then, what you can say about it beginning or ending.
 
MITech
 
Reply Sun 26 Oct, 2008 02:08 pm
@invulnerable23,
You see people think that there is a beginning and an end to time but that is not true. Time always exists.
 
invulnerable23
 
Reply Mon 27 Oct, 2008 08:51 am
@astrotheological,
If time is something separate from matter, that is, it exists when no matter exists, then sure, it can be infinite.

But if Time is contingent upon the existence of the physical world, then it's easily debatable that it exists eternally and infinitely. It could easily be relative to movement.
 
MITech
 
Reply Mon 27 Oct, 2008 02:18 pm
@invulnerable23,
invulnerable23 wrote:
If time is something separate from matter, that is, it exists when no matter exists, then sure, it can be infinite.

But if Time is contingent upon the existence of the physical world, then it's easily debatable that it exists eternally and infinitely. It could easily be relative to movement.


Well time is infininte because it is separate from matter. I don't know why people think that time is an actual thing be cause it isn't.
 
invulnerable23
 
Reply Mon 27 Oct, 2008 10:20 pm
@MITech,
Let us assume it is possible for the physical world to cease existing. Will time continue, after all matter is gone?

If time is something contingent upon the physical world, then it has also ceased, because there is nothing to relate to for time to exist. If time is separate from matter, then time will continue despite this end to the physical world, but what is it that time will effect and change? Without anything to exert it's force over, how can you know that time exists at all, after the physical world ceases to exist?
 
Khethil
 
Reply Tue 28 Oct, 2008 06:12 am
@invulnerable23,
invulnerable23 wrote:
Will time continue, after all matter is gone?


... and, would it really matter? :bigsmile:

In my opinion and in all seriousness, time is a concept we've made up to describe the regularity of intervals between events or actions. As such, since it never really existed (in an objective sense) in the first place. Whether or not it would exist, were we to disappear - to me - seems obvious in this view.
 
xris
 
Reply Tue 28 Oct, 2008 07:00 am
@Khethil,
It is an interesting concept the idea of no time...if it needs a physical universe to exist ?what happens or was not happening when there is no physical universe???? before the big bang there is no evidence of time so what was there or not before? If it came from a place of no time could this imagined creator exist in no time and is that where we go to? Ah i hear the convinced skeptics cry another route to a creator to be instantly denied....The concept of time being created by the big bang is the biggest mystery we have to resolve..Even now time is being created beyond the horizon of the expanding universe and will continue to be created till the universe ceases to exist.... then time will once again cease to exist..
 
invulnerable23
 
Reply Tue 28 Oct, 2008 09:23 am
@Khethil,
Khethil wrote:
... and, would it really matter? :bigsmile:

In my opinion and in all seriousness, time is a concept we've made up to describe the regularity of intervals between events or actions. As such, since it never really existed (in an objective sense) in the first place. Whether or not it would exist, were we to disappear - to me - seems obvious in this view.


Khethil, we just keep running into one another, don't we? Laughing

I actually agree with you wholeheartedly. My purpose is to try and stimulate discussion...

My two cents: Time is concept in man's mind to order movement and change in the universe. I suppose it's about the same thing you said. It's interesting to find someone so similar to my view.

Of course, the idea that follows is that if man ceases to exist, time does as well, in a manner of speaking. If other physical objects existed and moved and changed, that is only movement and change, not time.
 
xris
 
Reply Tue 28 Oct, 2008 09:59 am
@invulnerable23,
so whats time if its not movement and change?
 
invulnerable23
 
Reply Tue 28 Oct, 2008 10:10 am
@xris,
This is my own view, but I will oblige: Time is a way of organizing that movement and change on a large scale, in the minds of man.

When you say you are traveling 10 MPH, you mean that you are traveling in a set time, right? Well, not exactly. What you are doing is relating your movement and speed to the movement of the earth. You are traveling 10 miles every 1/24th the rotation of the earth.

In the same way, all movement in the universe becomes difficult to keep track of if you don't think of it as a large group of movement called "time". This time still has to have a basis of movement to relate to, so we use the sun, moon, and earth.

I hope that explains my position. :poke-eye:
 
 

 
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