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Adam's rib (why on earth?)

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Lily
 
Reply Tue 27 Oct, 2009 03:15 pm
Hi everyone, I've been thinking. Do men have one less rib on one side? I mean, God took one of Adam's ribs, and made Eve. Why would people start to belive in that if we all complete pair of ribs? Or wasn't this in the "making-period" of the man? Because, if it wasn't, then it's wouldn't be inherrited by Adam's sons. Or is the rib part just a way of clearifying that women are less worth then men? Does this exist in other cultures?

So, why did the early jews think that Eve was Adam's rib?
 
josh0335
 
Reply Tue 27 Oct, 2009 03:28 pm
@Lily,
Lily;100187 wrote:
Or is the rib part just a way of clearifying that women are less worth then men?


Why would you assume this?
 
TickTockMan
 
Reply Tue 27 Oct, 2009 03:35 pm
@Lily,
Lily;100187 wrote:
Hi everyone, I've been thinking. Do men have one less rib on one side? I mean, God took one of Adam's ribs, and made Eve. Why would people start to belive in that if we all complete pair of ribs? Or wasn't this in the "making-period" of the man? Because, if it wasn't, then it's wouldn't be inherrited by Adam's sons. Or is the rib part just a way of clearifying that women are less worth then men? Does this exist in other cultures?

So, why did the early jews think that Eve was Adam's rib?


WikiAnswers - How many ribs does a female person have

and:

WikiAnswers - What is the difference between a male and female rib cage

also (this one touches on the theological questions):
How Many Ribs?
 
Didymos Thomas
 
Reply Tue 27 Oct, 2009 03:36 pm
@josh0335,
Lily;100187 wrote:
I mean, God took one of Adam's ribs, and made Eve. Why would people start to belive in that if we all complete pair of ribs?


It's a creation myth. That sort of story is not to be believed; instead, they say something about mankind's situation in life. They are not to be understood literally, and to take them literally is the height of folly. It's also idolatry.

Lily;100187 wrote:
Or is the rib part just a way of clearifying that women are less worth then men? Does this exist in other cultures?


We have to remember that Adam and Eve were not aware of the differences in the sexes in the way we are. It could just as easily be that Eve gave up a rib for Adam, the meaning would be the same.

That aspect of the story has symbolic meaning, it informs us of our situation in life: in the Babylonian creation myth, the first man splits himself in two, thus making man and woman. The giving up of the rib reminds us that we must sacrifice for others or live alone, lonely.
 
Arjuna
 
Reply Tue 27 Oct, 2009 04:56 pm
@Lily,
Kind of reminds me of the Bride of Frankenstein, though.
 
Lily
 
Reply Sat 31 Oct, 2009 07:52 am
@Didymos Thomas,
Didymos Thomas;100195 wrote:

It could just as easily be that Eve gave up a rib for Adam, the meaning would be the same.
.

But Eve is created for Adam, and later on God tells her that she should obey Adam. (Genesis 3:16)

And I'm still a bit confused, because, back in the day, didn't they belive that acquired characteristics were past on to the next generation?
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Sat 31 Oct, 2009 08:49 am
@TickTockMan,
TickTockMan;100194 wrote:



Yes. Lamarkism is false. No inheritance of acquired characteristics. Although it had to be admitted that the way Adam acquired the characteristic of having one fewer rib is not ordinary.
 
xris
 
Reply Sat 31 Oct, 2009 09:08 am
@kennethamy,
I love spare ribs with BBQ sauce ummmm.
 
Didymos Thomas
 
Reply Sat 31 Oct, 2009 01:44 pm
@xris,
Lily;100805 wrote:
But Eve is created for Adam, and later on God tells her that she should obey Adam. (Genesis 3:16)


Eve is created because Adam is lonely. God commands Eve to obey Adam, but is this some chauvinistic expression or is it simply because it is Eve in the story who brings Adam the apple?

Lily;100805 wrote:
And I'm still a bit confused, because, back in the day, didn't they belive that acquired characteristics were past on to the next generation?


What's back in the day? When the Genesis myths (because there are several) were first written, or when they were finally edited into a text?

What we need to remember is that, back in the day to use your phrase, people would not have read these stories as literally true. Nor would they have imagined them only occurring some time in the past - they would have found them to be figurative, and therefore occurring in the past, present, and future. Even into the Middle Ages passion plays were performed in which details from scripture were altered and the settings were modern.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Sat 31 Oct, 2009 02:12 pm
@Didymos Thomas,
Didymos Thomas;100870 wrote:
Eve is created because Adam is lonely. God commands Eve to obey Adam, but is this some chauvinistic expression or is it simply because it is Eve in the story who brings Adam the apple?



What's back in the day? When the Genesis myths (because there are several) were first written, or when they were finally edited into a text?

What we need to remember is that, back in the day to use your phrase, people would not have read these stories as literally true. Nor would they have imagined them only occurring some time in the past - they would have found them to be figurative, and therefore occurring in the past, present, and future. Even into the Middle Ages passion plays were performed in which details from scripture were altered and the settings were modern.


Sure. Back in the Renaissance a great controversy unfolded about whether paintings of Adam should, or should not, show Adam as having a belly-button. The Omphalos controversy.
 
xris
 
Reply Sat 31 Oct, 2009 02:20 pm
@kennethamy,
So our moobs had no controversial interest ?
 
GoshisDead
 
Reply Sat 31 Oct, 2009 02:36 pm
@Didymos Thomas,
Didymos Thomas;100195 wrote:
It's a creation myth. That sort of story is not to be believed; instead, they say something about mankind's situation in life. They are not to be understood literally, and to take them literally is the height of folly. It's also idolatry.

Aren't creation myths the most fascinating things. I personally love a good earthdiver myth or a dimentional emergence myth.
 
prothero
 
Reply Sun 1 Nov, 2009 10:14 pm
@Lily,
In Genesis 1 man and women are created at the same time.

In Genesis 2 one has the comical scene of man is lonely and God creates the various creatures and presents them to Adam who names them but does not accept them to prevent his loneliness. God "how about this adam?" Adam "We will call this a lion but I am still lonely and so on". Finally Adams goes into a sleep and God creates eve from "his rib?" some Jewish sources will tell you the proper translation is Eve is created from Adams side.

So in Genesis 1 man and women are created at the same time, making them equall?
And in Genesis 2 woman is created from mans side, sounds more equal than rib?

In any event these stories having a meaning that is not literal, and this has always been understood by some but not all.
 
Lily
 
Reply Mon 2 Nov, 2009 02:45 pm
@prothero,
prothero;101165 wrote:

And in Genesis 2 woman is created from mans side, sounds more equal than rib?

yes, it totally does.
 
Kroni
 
Reply Wed 4 Nov, 2009 05:31 pm
@Lily,
Why would every man be born with one less rib just because Adam's was removed? That's like saying that if I lose a finger in an accident my son will be born with one less finger...What??? I can't imagine that people even in that time would actually believe something like that. I also don't see why God having something to do with it magically would make Adam's children be born with one less rib. Where would all those missing ribs be? God used Adam's to make Eve, but there's no logical equivalent for his children.
 
Lily
 
Reply Thu 5 Nov, 2009 09:15 am
@Kroni,
Kroni;101896 wrote:
Why would every man be born with one less rib just because Adam's was removed? That's like saying that if I lose a finger in an accident my son will be born with one less finger...What??? I can't imagine that people even in that time would actually believe something like that. I also don't see why God having something to do with it magically would make Adam's children be born with one less rib. Where would all those missing ribs be? God used Adam's to make Eve, but there's no logical equivalent for his children.

Jean-Baptiste Lamarck - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

and, as I said, one could think that Adam is still in the making process, and therefor not fully developed.
 
Lithe Oleander
 
Reply Sun 6 Dec, 2009 04:19 pm
@Lily,
...and as Prometheus was bounded to the rock an eagle would come every day to peck at his side and eat his live (which is under the lower rib)

...and when they came to Jesus, they found he was already dead, and so instead of breaking his legs, one of the soldiers pierced his side with his lance; and immediately there came out blood and water
 
prothero
 
Reply Sun 6 Dec, 2009 05:32 pm
@Lily,
It was from Adam's "side". "Rib" is just a bad translation, like "virgin" for "young woman" and "kill" for "murder".
 
Lily
 
Reply Sat 12 Dec, 2009 11:27 am
@prothero,
prothero;108615 wrote:
It was from Adam's "side". "Rib" is just a bad translation, like "virgin" for "young woman" and "kill" for "murder".

Ah, language is complicated:sarcastic:.
 
dan b
 
Reply Sat 26 Dec, 2009 06:40 pm
@kennethamy,
Hello philosophers,

Why is Eve taken from Adam's rib? Adam and Eve were not the first people who God created, they were the first to begin using word language in a major way. That is why they can be traced to about 4000BC in Mesopotamia. Modern historical and archeoogical evidence traces the earliest civilizations to them.

In the begining god created the Heaven and the earth. Then he continued creating everything in this entire world over the next six days. And on the seventh day God rested.Gen.2;2

Then, just three verses later in Gen.2;5 it tells us that "there was not a man to till the ground." Although there had been humans since the days when God created them, but up to this point of time none of them had started farming Civilizationally. They were all still cave men!

So Genesis names Adam and Eve as the ones who began Mesopotamian Civilization about 4000BC. Thats why in Gen 4 their decendants are said to invent everything.

So, from the above point of view, I would venture to say, that possible the statement "and he took one of his ribs" brings attention to the place of the breast=chest=breathing=speaking. Because if Adam's "breath of life" from God in Gen.2;7 is the ability to use words, then thats why Eve came from Adam. Immediatly after Adam got the breath of life(ability to use gramatical language) he was brought the animals to "name." So the bible shows us that in Adam's time words were yet unused. So he named the animala.Gen.2;20 So Eve isn't second class or lower than Adam. Even Adam had just been"formed out of the dust of the ground." It's the breath of life that counts here, and so the rib for Eve. Then they were the first who's minds began to whirl with the utility for though offered by gramatical language. So began Civilization. Thanks Eve. dan b
 
 

 
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