right/wrong in moral relativism

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Didymos Thomas
 
Reply Fri 6 Mar, 2009 06:20 pm
@re turner jr,
A moral relativist knows something is right or wrong when (if he/she is a individual relativist, we can use P, a cultural relativist S): S/P believes something to be right/wrong.
 
hue-man
 
Reply Tue 31 Mar, 2009 11:05 am
@click here,
click here wrote:
I have heard it said that an action by a moral relativist is deemed 'wrong' by how the action 'inhibits the growth of a civil society'

That definition just seems way to general to me and I think that a better definition needs to be created or shown.


Rape is often seen as wrong by a moral relativist because it appears to inhibit the growth of a civil society. My question is how is it determined when the act fully inhibits or imporves a society?

For example:

Jenny gets raped by Mike. Jenny use to be a very quiet woman that wasn't going anywhere with her job. This act of rape gave her the fierce desire to advance in her job because she now is a more driven individual. She started her own business that in 10 years grew to be the largest company to provide clean water to thousands in Africa.

When she was raped that act was good because it influenced the positive growth of a society and benefited many more people then those that it affected negatively.

What are your thoughts and or comments.


I think that a true relativist would say that rape as a moral wrong is relative to the society that defines it is as such. So in a civil society, rape would be defined as wrong. I believe I spoke to you about this some months ago. It was me who said that it depends upon a civil society, but that does not go for all relativists. Some relativists can be nihilistic, and in fact, some philosophers have argued against relativism as an ethical theory for that very reason.

I have since taken the meta-ethical position of moral universalism. All values are subjective (mind-dependent), but fundamental values should fit four criteria to be considered as such. A fundamental value should be universal, impartial, compatible, and maximal. In order for a value to be justified it should fit these four criteria. If a value does not at least fit the criteria of universality and impartiality then the value is relative to the valuer.
 
Phosphorous
 
Reply Wed 1 Apr, 2009 05:50 pm
@click here,
I thought the whole point of moral relativism was that you couldn't make an objective, absolute stance on a certain action being good or bad. Isn't that precisely what The OP is asking for?

You'd be better off just becoming a moral absolutist, I think.
 
hue-man
 
Reply Thu 2 Apr, 2009 07:43 am
@Phosphorous,
Phosphorous wrote:
I thought the whole point of moral relativism was that you couldn't make an objective, absolute stance on a certain action being good or bad. Isn't that precisely what The OP is asking for?

You'd be better off just becoming a moral absolutist, I think.


The point of moral relativism is that they believe whether or not a moral sentence is right or wrong is determined by the society, culture or individual that defines the act as right or wrong. There is little difference between it and moral nihilism, and most don't even consider it to be a moral theory anymore than moral nihilism is a moral theory.

Morality and any conceptions of value are subjective, not because it cannot be universally applied, but because it is mind-dependent. Objectivity is a concept that is mind-independent.

Here is the difference between moral absolutism and moral universalism:

  • "Moral absolutism: There is at least one principle that ought never to be violated."


  • "Moral universalism: There is a fact of the matter as to whether any given action is morally permissible or impermissible: a fact of the matter that does not depend solely on social custom or individual acceptance."

Moral universalism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Moral universalism: Encyclopedia - Moral universalism
 
Phosphorous
 
Reply Thu 2 Apr, 2009 12:24 pm
@click here,
so what's the OP's problem, then?
 
EmperorNero
 
Reply Tue 21 Apr, 2009 03:17 pm
@click here,
click here;48975 wrote:
I have heard it said that an action by a moral relativist is deemed 'wrong' by how the action 'inhibits the growth of a civil society'

That definition just seems way to general to me and I think that a better definition needs to be created or shown.


Rape is often seen as wrong by a moral relativist because it appears to inhibit the growth of a civil society. My question is how is it determined when the act fully inhibits or imporves a society?

For example:

Jenny gets raped by Mike. Jenny use to be a very quiet woman that wasn't going anywhere with her job. This act of rape gave her the fierce desire to advance in her job because she now is a more driven individual. She started her own business that in 10 years grew to be the largest company to provide clean water to thousands in Africa.

When she was raped that act was good because it influenced the positive growth of a society and benefited many more people then those that it affected negatively.

What are your thoughts and or comments.


I would say moral relativism is just excusing bad actions with others.
There is no real consistency there. Correct me if I'm wrong.
 
 

 
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