My predictions for the future

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Marat phil
 
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 10:40 am
@Soul Brother,
Soul Brother;156433 wrote:
First 90 only proves how much man is failing.

---------- Post added 04-26-2010 at 01:53 AM ----------



I must correct you on the following:
*There is such a thing as renewable energy.
*All energy is not "used up" as energy cannot be created nor destroyed.
*Earth is not infinite, therefore fossil fuels (ARE) finite.
*The resources of which we speak are NOT created by humans, they are
only harvested by humans.


Classical mechanics + Theory of relativity
Laws of thermodynamics + ? We wait new scientific revolution.
 
Soul Brother
 
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 07:57 pm
@Marat phil,
Marat;156456 wrote:
Classical mechanics + Theory of relativity
Laws of thermodynamics + ? We wait new scientific revolution.


I implied nothing of mechanics, GR or any "new scientific revolution"
but of the 1st law and the conservation of energy.
 
EmperorNero
 
Reply Thu 20 May, 2010 09:14 am
@chopkins,
chopkins;154682 wrote:
I see your point in "no such thing as renewable energy," and infinite alternative fuels. But from the way i understand it, "renewable energy" just means energy that is easily and quickly obtained with relatively minimal effort that is able to be produced in the same quantity as fossil fuels, but less harmful to the planet in the long run. So, i dont think they necessarily mean its going to be renewable in the physics sense, because you are right, energy is always used and transfered completely from one source to another. However, if you take ethanol, for example, or used deep frier oil, they are effective alternatives to petroleum based products. There is a far more finite supply of oil reserves on this planet and indeed on this continent (North America) than most people want to believe. Instead of waiting another 100 years and saying, "eh, let our children's children deal with the problem, it doesnt affect me," we could take a proactive step and attempt to free ourselves from the burden that is oil. But now i feel like im on a soap box.


The technology to use a new (and better) resource is always invented because the last resource became expensive, not because we decided that it would be a good idea.
I completely agree that burning oil is a mess, not the least because of the pollution. We should find an alternative, such as nuclear fission or fusion. (Wind and solar are a joke.)
But technological progress does not happen because we decide that it would be a good idea and get to it.
We are so used to progress that we think it's something that just happens because time goes by. But technological progress happens because of necessity, not because we want it enough. We will free ourselves from the burden that is oil for the same reason we did with firewood and coal and every other resource. Because getting a hold of the old resource becomes more of a pain in the ass than inventing the new one; we always take the easy way out.
It is alluring to think that progress is a result of our wanting it enough, and that we can "do something" to make it happen quicker, to "take a proactive step". And that not "doing something" is merely kicking the can down the road, or just "waiting". But that's not how it works.
Government action or voluntary austerity will only delay progress; by reducing oil consumption we lower the price of oil and make it less profitable to find an alternative to oil, which results in it being used longer.

chopkins;154682 wrote:
As for climate change not being an actual problem...
you do realize that the temperature of the earth has risen since the 1970s an average of one degree ferenheit, and the eight hottest years on record to date, since 1880, have been the years of 2001 onward (warmest in 2005).


It is not even that clear to me whether there is actual warming. I hear different numbers all the time. The studies that were hyped a few years ago are mostly discredited now. Climate scientists only stay employed if they report a problem. And we find out that more and more of their work was seriously fraudulent. Not to mention that politicians are suspiciously united about global warming. And practically everyone who advocates global warming seems to have close ties to the oil companies. You know, the guys who would make billions on the carbon trading schemes.
And - oh what coincidence - it just so happens that we can still do something about global warming, but we have to act really hastily, there is no time to think about it.

But even if there is warming, how do we know it's a man-made phenomenon? Climate always changed.

Even if it is human greenhouse gas emissions that causes global warming, we could only reduce emissions by negligible amounts. And the effects of global warming are said to be accumulative. Reducing emissions can't do a damn bit of difference about the climate. But sacrificing our industrial strength would significantly reduce our capabilities to deal with the effects, man-made or natural. Does anyone advocate that? No, the alarmists only want carbon trading and greater government control over personal lives, very suspicious.

---------- Post added 05-20-2010 at 05:41 PM ----------

Soul Brother;156433 wrote:
I think you have mistaken the meaning of renewable energy which is defined as energy that is a product result of natural phenomena and is naturally replenished,


Yes, you are right that the definition of a renewable energy source includes that it has to be naturally replenished, not replenished by man. But that is somewhat of a misleading definition, as it confuses us into thinking that oil is limited to currently known and technologically and economically extractable reserves.
A new technology that allows us to find more oil or extract oil from sources that were not worth the cost of extraction before would literally replenish oil reserves. That's why oil reserves seem to magically grow in step with consumption.

Solar energy is renewed by being added from outside earth, but even solar energy is ultimately finite in the sense that the sun is finite. Known exploitable oil reserves are renewed by advancements in extraction technology, that make more of the existing physical stuff exploitable. All the oil in the world is ultimately finite, like the sun, but the resource oil is renewable. Therefore oil and solar energy are equally renewable, just the method by which they are renewed is different.

---------- Post added 05-20-2010 at 06:13 PM ----------

Soul Brother;156433 wrote:
Energy companies are simply a product of western capitalism, think about it, they make the poor poorer and the rich richer,


Actually, the oil companies made possible some the greatest advances in the standard of living of the poor in history. The rich always had material abundance, but industrialization and fossil fuels made abundance available everyone. In that sense they are the greatest liberators in history. Those who work to make the poor poorer and the rich richer are the phony environmentalists and the wealthy elites, who use fear to revert us to a pre-industrial stage, where only the elites have material abundance.

Soul Brother;156433 wrote:
they are part of a system that is intently designed to keep the working class working all of their lives, like a dog pursuing his tail, reaching for grapes you can never grasp, whilst a few in power rule and control from the top of the chain of command down through all levels of the system, (get to know these few).


Everybody who leases out their work for money is a capitalist. If they save and produce something that others want they can become wealthy themselves. There is no such thing as "the worker class" and "the capitalist class".

Only five percent of families in the bottom income quintile (the lowest 20 percent) in 1975 were still there in 1991. Three-quarters of these families had moved into the three highest income quintiles. During the same period, 70 percent of those in the second lowest income quintile moved to a higher quintile, with 25 percent of them moving to the top income quintile.
The U.S. Treasury found that 85.8 percent of tax filers in the bottom income quintile in 1979 had moved on to a higher quintile by 1988 - 66 percent to second and third quintiles and 15 percent to the top quintile.
Walter E. Williams : The poverty hype - Townhall.com

Soul Brother;156433 wrote:
*All energy is not "used up" as energy cannot be created nor destroyed.


Yes, in physics we learn that energy can not be destroyed. But it can change form and therefore is "used up" for our purposes.

Soul Brother;156433 wrote:
*The resources of which we speak are NOT created by humans, they are only harvested by humans.


Physical stuff is harvested by humans, but resources are created by humans.
Read this: http://www.philosophyforum.com/philosophy-forums/secondary-branches-philosophy/philosophy-science/8079-resources-infinite.html
 
 

 
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