Are you negative or positive about our existence?

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Reply Sun 28 Jun, 2009 05:59 am
I think this is a very important question.

Lots of people are negative about life not having any inerrant purpose. But I think it would suck if it did. Imagine if you existed and started out with a book of rules written by god telling us that we are here too... erm... create a soul for ourselves? And we keep living lives untill we get to the point of being a all loving perfect soul.... Something like that.
Im much happier with the idea that we can create (recognize our) purpose ourselves. It gives us alot more freedom.

Lots of people are also negative about the fact we are going to die anyway so whats the point? Thats an ego perspective. Its just your ego's natural reaction. People that think that arent looking hard enough. Life is a series of moments that are consciousness experiences. Some of these moments put in order give us the illusion that they are going in the direction of them coming to a stop (end). Time and memories create this delusional state. I think its very interesting our consciousness can experience things like being separate from other parts of it and how we would react with the illusion that it is going to stop one day.

This is my positive take on the main things that give people depression about existence. However I do often feel depressed and negative. But I use this as a sign i need to grow in that area. There are still fears and things i havnt faced at the back of my mind that I need to face so i can atleaset rationalise (understand) it.


My question to you is. Are you negative or positive about this figment we call existence?
 
richrf
 
Reply Sun 28 Jun, 2009 08:30 am
@glasstrees,
dwixi;72997 wrote:
I think this is a very important question.

Lots of people are negative about life not having any inerrant purpose. But I think it would suck if it did. Imagine if you existed and started out with a book of rules written by god telling us that we are here too... erm... create a soul for ourselves? And we keep living lives untill we get to the point of being a all loving perfect soul.... Something like that.
Im much happier with the idea that we can create purpose ourselves. It gives us alot more freedom.

Lots of people are also negative about the fact we are going to die anyway so whats the point? Thats an ego perspective. Its just your ego's natral reaction. People that think that arent looking hard enough. Life is a series of moments that are consciousness experiences. Some of these moments put in order give us the illusion that they are going in the direction of them coming to a stop. Time and memories create this delusional state. I think its very interesting our consciousness can experience things like being separate from other parts of it and how we would react with the illusion that it is going to stop one day.

This is my positive take on the main things that give people depression about existence. However I do often feel depressed and negative. But I use this as a sign i need to grow in that area. There are still fears and things i havnt faced at the back of my mind that I need to face so i can atleaset rationalise it.


My question to you is. Are you negative or positive about this figment we call existence?


Hi,

I have ups and downs in life. Most of my friends experience the same feelings. It is probably inherent in life.

It feels to me like a pendulum. The more the pendulum rises in one direction the more it swings over to the other direction. So, I just don't look to rise so much and therefore I don't swing over to the other side as much. It seems to work.

Examples of how the pendulum of life (consciousness) creates shapes:

Pendulum Gallery

http://bulbphotography.com/_images/usuff/pendulum-image1.jpg

Rich
 
William
 
Reply Sun 28 Jun, 2009 08:46 am
@glasstrees,
dwixi;72997 wrote:
I think this is a very important question.

Lots of people are negative about life not having any inerrant purpose. But I think it would suck if it did. Imagine if you existed and started out with a book of rules written by god telling us that we are here too... erm... create a soul for ourselves? And we keep living lives untill we get to the point of being a all loving perfect soul.... Something like that.
Im much happier with the idea that we can create (recognize our) purpose ourselves. It gives us alot more freedom.

Lots of people are also negative about the fact we are going to die anyway so whats the point? Thats an ego perspective. Its just your ego's natural reaction. People that think that arent looking hard enough. Life is a series of moments that are consciousness experiences. Some of these moments put in order give us the illusion that they are going in the direction of them coming to a stop (end). Time and memories create this delusional state. I think its very interesting our consciousness can experience things like being separate from other parts of it and how we would react with the illusion that it is going to stop one day.

This is my positive take on the main things that give people depression about existence. However I do often feel depressed and negative. But I use this as a sign i need to grow in that area. There are still fears and things i havnt faced at the back of my mind that I need to face so i can atleaset rationalise (understand) it.


My question to you is. Are you negative or positive about this figment we call existence?


Hello my friend, you are on the right track. If you would consider the above changes I offer to your perspecitve, if you don't mind.Smile

Thanks,
William
 
Imnotrussian
 
Reply Fri 10 Jul, 2009 05:53 pm
@glasstrees,
I am positive about the freedoms delivered to me within my own existence but i hate the human race and the damage we do. I know the causes are within isolated groups but its these groups that run our planet. This world is rotting and falling apart and although i try my hardest to bring some light into my life and the lives of others around me it is overshadowed by fear and war and crime. Im no saint but i would never take someones liberty, freedom or livelihood and im so angry about the direction we are headed. If i ran the world, Things would certainly be different
 
aimee phil
 
Reply Fri 14 Aug, 2009 07:23 pm
@glasstrees,
nothing at all matters that is my opinion.
i dont really think that it is negative i think that it is being aware.
i think the problem is that instead of seeing ourselves as animals in which we are.
we have convinced ourselves that we are these superior beings with a purpose to live
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Fri 14 Aug, 2009 07:44 pm
@aimee phil,
aimee;83351 wrote:
nothing at all matters that is my opinion.


You should not be so self-effacing. I am sure your opinions matter to someone.
 
prothero
 
Reply Fri 14 Aug, 2009 09:12 pm
@glasstrees,
I am a lot happier and more optimistic when entertaining the notion:
That the universe is alive, enchanted and perceptive to the core (panpsychism).
That the universe is engaged in a perpetual process of creative advance and perpetually becoming (possiblity becoming reality):

Than entertaining the notion that:
The universe is a mechanistic materialistic deterministic machine in which life and mind are accidental and ultimately purposeless chance happenings.

The choice of worldviews one essentially religious and the other essentially atheistic is just that a choice. Nothing in reason, science or experience dictates one choice over the other.
 
manored
 
Reply Mon 17 Aug, 2009 10:38 am
@Imnotrussian,
Imnotrussian;76469 wrote:
I am positive about the freedoms delivered to me within my own existence but i hate the human race and the damage we do. I know the causes are within isolated groups but its these groups that run our planet. This world is rotting and falling apart and although i try my hardest to bring some light into my life and the lives of others around me it is overshadowed by fear and war and crime. Im no saint but i would never take someones liberty, freedom or livelihood and im so angry about the direction we are headed. If i ran the world, Things would certainly be different
It has always been rotting and falling apart, having such an impression seens to be a natural aspect of humanity. I think, though, that we might be getting to the point of our history where we might be able to change this =)

aimee;83351 wrote:
nothing at all matters that is my opinion.
i dont really think that it is negative i think that it is being aware.
i think the problem is that instead of seeing ourselves as animals in which we are.
we have convinced ourselves that we are these superior beings with a purpose to live
I agree, having no purpose is no problem at all, we just make ourselves one and live on. I also agree we shouldnt see ourselves as above animals, that causes some people to put other species or some weird concepts of the planet being "living" above our own.

prothero;83368 wrote:
I am a lot happier and more optimistic when entertaining the notion:
That the universe is alive, enchanted and perceptive to the core (panpsychism).
That the universe is engaged in a perpetual process of creative advance and perpetually becoming (possiblity becoming reality):

Than entertaining the notion that:
The universe is a mechanistic materialistic deterministic machine in which life and mind are accidental and ultimately purposeless chance happenings.

The choice of worldviews one essentially religious and the other essentially atheistic is just that a choice. Nothing in reason, science or experience dictates one choice over the other.
Indeed, that is quite nice =)

Personally I hold the second view for my current life, and something similar to the first view to the universe as a whole.

Im not sure if being negative about existence is affordable, because it cannot be ended. Whenever to exist is a curse or a bless, it is ever-lasting, and thus being negative about it will only cause suffering, its happier to be positive about it and have joy in life =)
 
Ponderj
 
Reply Mon 17 Aug, 2009 06:25 pm
@aimee phil,
aimee;83351 wrote:
nothing at all matters that is my opinion.



Hmm, If nothing at all matters, then what does anything at all mean to you? could it be nothing?
 
G-Thomson
 
Reply Wed 19 Aug, 2009 03:17 pm
@glasstrees,
I'm just an overall negative, apathetic and pessimistic human being.
My Philosophical thoughts and Athiesm have done nothing but heighten this feeling.
I am generally a happy person with others and I'm also happy when ranting about something that annoys me. I would not like to live under (what I would call) a false and even more meaningless existence than the one I live in now.
I would not want to try and please a God only to come to a sudden realisation later in life that Gods do not exist, then realise that I have wasted most of my adult life believing in (what I would call) an imaginary sky-daddy.
On the majority of occassions I am happy with my apathetic and negative nature as in many ways I feel that I can look down upon those who have 'faith' or are vain or people who just look happy ALL the time.

I'm only 17, and sometimes question whether I should really be this negative about things and I always come up with the exact same answer.

It doesn't bother me.
 
manored
 
Reply Wed 19 Aug, 2009 04:54 pm
@G-Thomson,
G-Thomson;84384 wrote:
I'm just an overall negative, apathetic and pessimistic human being.
My Philosophical thoughts and Athiesm have done nothing but heighten this feeling.
I am generally a happy person with others and I'm also happy when ranting about something that annoys me. I would not like to live under (what I would call) a false and even more meaningless existence than the one I live in now.
I would not want to try and please a God only to come to a sudden realisation later in life that Gods do not exist, then realise that I have wasted most of my adult life believing in (what I would call) an imaginary sky-daddy.
On the majority of occassions I am happy with my apathetic and negative nature as in many ways I feel that I can look down upon those who have 'faith' or are vain or people who just look happy ALL the time.

I'm only 17, and sometimes question whether I should really be this negative about things and I always come up with the exact same answer.

It doesn't bother me.
Indeed, it is true that negativistic people can also be happy. I like to think there are two "kinds" of negativism: Furious and depressive. Furious means you are angry at the world for its mistakes, what leads you to fight to change things or show the world how wrong it is. depressive means you have no hope of ever changing anything and just moan =)
 
Ponderj
 
Reply Thu 20 Aug, 2009 04:18 pm
@G-Thomson,
Heh so many on this Forum seem negative :surrender:. Anything regarding Eastern Philosophy is a good read for some of you negative people out there, because of the fact that it focuses more on personal enlightenment rather than the meaning of everything around yourself.
 
gaz7224
 
Reply Thu 20 Aug, 2009 04:45 pm
@glasstrees,
I strive for balance. I try and see life for all its colours. Sometimes life sucks, other times it is heavenly. I have a positive outlook. I don't do positive thinking though because that tends to push the negative away, which isn't true life - just a fantasy.

The negatives are opportunities to learn and grow, however painful they maybe.

Hope I understood what you were asking.

Gaz
 
manored
 
Reply Fri 21 Aug, 2009 11:32 am
@gaz7224,
gaz7224;84580 wrote:
I strive for balance. I try and see life for all its colours. Sometimes life sucks, other times it is heavenly. I have a positive outlook. I don't do positive thinking though because that tends to push the negative away, which isn't true life - just a fantasy.

The negatives are opportunities to learn and grow, however painful they maybe.

Hope I understood what you were asking.

Gaz
I dont really believe in "true life" =)
 
Krumple
 
Reply Fri 21 Aug, 2009 10:34 pm
@glasstrees,
Quote:
I dont really believe in "true life" =)


Great one liner, where did you get it?

I think it is healthy to be negative in certain cases just as long as you have something positive to back it up with. Too much of any one thing can make ya spiral out of control. Yes that includes being to optimistically positive, as much as that might sound impossible, it can still be too much of a good thing. See how I did that? Turned a positive into a negative? I can do the same with negatives, reread the first line...
 
jeeprs
 
Reply Sat 22 Aug, 2009 02:15 am
@glasstrees,
dwixi;72997 wrote:
Imagine if you existed and started out with a book of rules written by god telling us that we are here too... erm... create a soul for ourselves?


I don't know if this is an accurate portrayal of the religious attitude. For example, in Catholicism, freedom of will is axiomatic, it is a given. The idea is that unless we willingly choose what is good, it is not good. If we were just made to behave a certain way, we would be automatons, robots. There would be nothing good about it. Goodness must be freely chosen.

Secondly just because something is lawful, doesn't mean that it dictates your outcome. There are road rules but you can drive where you like. Music has rules of harmony but you can compose whatever you like.

Many believe that freedom is doing whatever you like, and then of course having the money to do it. This is the basic idea of freedom in the world today for many people. But as you have noticed, no matter what our circumstances, we won't live forever and often suffer misfortune.

And that is why we study philosophy:bigsmile:
 
Khethil
 
Reply Sat 22 Aug, 2009 06:54 am
@glasstrees,
dwixi;72997 wrote:
My question to you is. Are you negative or positive about this figment we call existence?


Good question. I'm not sure my view can be called predominantly negative or positive; sometimes one, sometimes the other. I suppose if I had to choose, it'd likely be more towards the latter.

What I do consciously work towards is a more "this is just how it is"-mindset. For those times I feel particularly negative about my existence, it helps quell my anger. When I start to go too far over that Rosey-Cliff (unrealistically positive), it helps keep me grounded.

How successful I am at accepting the reality of my own condition - only railing at that which I can change - is simultaneously the extent I'm more at peace with myself. Knowing this, and doing it aren't quite as easy though

Thanks
 
manored
 
Reply Sat 22 Aug, 2009 10:30 am
@Krumple,
Krumple;84863 wrote:
Great one liner, where did you get it?

I think it is healthy to be negative in certain cases just as long as you have something positive to back it up with. Too much of any one thing can make ya spiral out of control. Yes that includes being to optimistically positive, as much as that might sound impossible, it can still be too much of a good thing. See how I did that? Turned a positive into a negative? I can do the same with negatives, reread the first line...
On myself =)

I agree that being too positive is bad for health, but I wonder if it is bad for the conscience... I mean, cant a crazy person be happier than a healthy one? And who is the crazy one, by the way? See, what is healthy depends of what you want in life =)

jeeprs;84871 wrote:
I don't know if this is an accurate portrayal of the religious attitude. For example, in Catholicism, freedom of will is axiomatic, it is a given. The idea is that unless we willingly choose what is good, it is not good. If we were just made to behave a certain way, we would be automatons, robots. There would be nothing good about it. Goodness must be freely chosen.
I find the whole thing a big contradiction though... if god offers us a choice, why it forces us to chose good by menacing us with eternal punishment? It would be better off figuring who is good and who is bad by saying nothing. Also, if god is omniscient, as catholicism claims, why it even bothers to make the test if it knows the result? It could skip straigh to the rewards and punishments part. Finally, if our motivation to be good is heaven and the avoidance of hell, doesnt that means we are doing good out of self-interest, and not trully because we care for others?
 
mister kitten
 
Reply Sat 22 Aug, 2009 11:17 am
@G-Thomson,
G-Thomson;84384 wrote:
...I feel that I can look down upon those who have 'faith' or are vain or people who just look happy ALL the time.


That doesn't make me feel good. What does looking down on others do for you?

My math teacher once said that if you can make everything around you more positive, then this positivity will only be reflected back towards you. The same would happen if you make everything around you negetive, you will get negetivity in return.
I agree with this. I think that it helps to be more positive yourself, if you're trying to make things more positive.

As for the original question- I am generally positive towards existance. Everything is so very interesting. If a picture is worth a thousand words, then life must be worth an infinite number of words! Very Happy
 
G-Thomson
 
Reply Sat 22 Aug, 2009 11:48 am
@mister kitten,
Yeah, the thing is that for some unexplainable reason, I get a kick out of my negativity.
Looking down on others makes me feel superior I guess. I don't really like it either, but I can't really help it. I've tried, but when someone says don't think of a chicken, it's pretty hard to not picture poultry in the old noggin.
When I try and not think negatively, I start picking out the flaws in things.
 
 

 
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