An Answer to Horror???

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Reply Fri 23 Jan, 2009 12:57 pm
 
Icon
 
Reply Fri 23 Jan, 2009 01:26 pm
@Catchabula,
Catchabula wrote:


There is no solution Catchabula. Where there is good, there is evil. Where there is power, there is weakness. Where there is intelligence, there is stupidity. And where there is sanity and love, there is insanity and hate.

Men like this exist and they are the antithesis to all that I hold true in life. Still, there is the truth that they exist. Perhaps they exist to remind us of horror; to remind us of mortality and our choices to live and let live. Perhaps they are simply there because of the normal strives constrictions on the unbalanced mind.

For what ever reason they exist, we can learn from them. We can dispise them with all that we are and we can condemn them. I choose not to understand and not even to attempt rationalizing because you cannot. Their minds are twisted and distorted into knots of emotion driven insanity and there is no cure.

Still, we are not all this way. We can choose to ignore this or we can choose to let this moment make a mark on us. Your choice.
 
xris
 
Reply Fri 23 Jan, 2009 02:29 pm
@Icon,
My condolences Catch , i believe he had mental problems..thankfully he had only a knife and not a gun. I cant imagine the anguish of those poor parents. Take care Xris..
 
Fido
 
Reply Fri 23 Jan, 2009 04:17 pm
@Catchabula,
From what lofty height does anyone declare anyone sane??? With society so insane and humanity too; it is easy eneogh to see some one is insane, but who is sane, and who is sane enough to declare sanity??? How would any one know???I can't say what is in my mind until I can give if some form of expression, so how would any one know the mind of another???
 
Khethil
 
Reply Fri 23 Jan, 2009 04:22 pm
@Fido,
Sorry to hear it Catch.

I've learned, over time, that there's both a horror and beauty to human behavior. One's just as likely to run into a monster as they are an angel. Humanity's a grab bag of unfathomable diversity and those who'd do harm (such as what you related) may not even be the worst of it.

I wouldn't look for justice; the only that exists (insofar as that term has any widespread meaning) is that which we create - and then, it's only relative with blades that often cut two ways.

So I dunno; take solace in what you love, give faith in whom you can and dole out compassion at every opportunity. I have to believe somewhere down the road we might yet become a species with more a widespread appreciation for life.

Thanks
 
nameless
 
Reply Fri 23 Jan, 2009 11:12 pm
@Catchabula,
"Sometimes the beauty of existence is almost too exquisitely painful to bear; the tears bitter and sweet!"
 
Joe
 
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 05:43 am
@nameless,
Hey Catchabula

(Sigh) Dont always know how to express the confusion and loneliness that happens when life is lost. Especially so young.

It hurts.

How do we understand the detachment of the individual that commits acts such as these? Does it even matter? I would say yes.

Why does something so dark, instill something so real and intense within me. these events are truly beyond clear definition.

So what is left? You.

what do you represent?

Love. As does everyone.

See my blog about a random take on craziness.

.........Bout all I can say.
 
Catchabula
 
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 11:19 am
@Joe,
 
Bonaventurian
 
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 12:36 pm
@Catchabula,
Revelations 21:4 wrote:
And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes: and death shall be no more, nor mourning, nor crying, nor sorrow shall be any more, for the former things are passed away.


Isaias 2:4 wrote:
And he shall judge the Gentiles, and rebuke many people: and they shall turn their swords into ploughshares, and their spears into sickles: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they be exercised any more to war.


http://i383.photobucket.com/albums/oo274/Bonaventurian/mass-4.jpg

http://i383.photobucket.com/albums/oo274/Bonaventurian/untitled.jpg

http://i383.photobucket.com/albums/oo274/Bonaventurian/divine_mercy.jpg
 
nameless
 
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 01:21 pm
@Catchabula,
^^^

http://www.telugubhakti.com/TELUGUPAGES/Pdfs/Ganesh/Ganesh.jpg
 
Joshy phil
 
Reply Sat 24 Jan, 2009 02:44 pm
@nameless,
I just want to focus on the question of 'What is sanity?'

Surely the only definition we hold for sanity is the state of mind and reasoning of the majority. However, what if the majority are in the wrong state of mind? Is this similar to the belief that common sense is no longer common?
We view somebody as insane because they take actions that we would not even think about. But what if that person had sane reasons for performing an act? Could we be classed as 'insane' for condemning them?
I am not agreeing with what the man did in Dendermond, and in this particular case, I can think of no sound reasoning to justify what he did: to attack young children. To be honest, it sickens me, and is only a familiar reminder that nobody in this world is truly safe from the 'horror'.

There is no real answer to this 'horror', unless one were to shield oneself off from the rest of the world. But surely that in itself would upset the state of mind of one, causing self-inflicted 'horror'.
 
manored
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 12:08 pm
@Catchabula,
Catchabula wrote:
First I would like to say that there is no reason to fell sad for those who died, because they no longer suffer, but rather one should fell sad for those who didnt died or for the people related for those who did. It helps to think this way because the people who stayed are also those who can be helped.

The answer is probability I believe, that is, althought the probability may be small, there is always a chance a certain event will happen, such as one person deciding it has to kill children. It helps to understand it by seeing that it is just as an randow accident that could have happened, for example, a sizable meteor could have hit the creche and annihilated it. If meteors can fall and kill people, then people can be born with weird mental diseases wich eventually cause then to do things like that. Its just hard to understand because both such level of blood-coldness and such level of hatred against humans are rare, even more rare combined.

I think the only way to deal with this is to learn to control emotions, that is, harden your mind against suffering from the bad events that happened outside of your control, and open it to the good ones.

And one thing to think: And inteligent and radicalist friend of mine said the main reason this kind of thing keeps happening is because some people get tired of life and decide to "leave it with a bang", and they would do so knowing that everone would know about what they did, and that they would at max be imprisioned forever or executed painlessly. He said that the solution would be that people who did such things were tortured to dead in public. He gave as example one country (I dont remember the name) where if someone kills someone, the closest relative of the victim gets the right to shot the killer 20 times, being the only condition that the last shot must be on the head. The country has one of the lowest homicide ratings in the world.
 
Bones-O
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 12:30 pm
@Catchabula,
Horrible news indeed. But try not to associate this twisted fellow with humanity. Along the way, the human species produces some mistakes, but I like to think it does not tend to propagate them. We'll never be free of cases such as this; events like Columbine can be reduced with gun control, but not this. But humanity will never be undermined by these people either though, so there's hope.

I'm wondering what effect the reportage of these events has on the perpetrators of the next. If some people are after notoriety, might they aim at it by doing something worse than anything they've heard of, or else at least otherwise be inspired by past atrocities?
 
Catchabula
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:05 pm
@manored,
manored wrote:
He said that the solution would be that people who did such things were tortured to dead in public. He gave as example one country (I dont remember the name) where if someone kills someone, the closest relative of the victim gets the right to shot the killer 20 times, being the only condition that the last shot must be on the head. The country has one of the lowest homicide ratings in the world.


I had almost thanked you, Mano. But then I read the last sentences. Sorry to say this, but there something WILDLY wrong here! Am I the only one to feel like that?
 
Joshy phil
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:12 pm
@Catchabula,
Catchabula wrote:
I had almost thanked you, Mano. But then I read the last sentences. Sorry to say this, but there something WILDLY wrong here! Am I the only one to feel like that?


No, I feel that same.

I don't think that, no matter what people do, revenge is the answer. Torturing somebody like that would surely make you as bad as, or worse than, them.
Of course, I'm not saying that we should all forgive and forget, as what some people do can be traumatic and stressful, but rather seek for them to receive a consequence to their actions that serves justice rightfully.
 
xris
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:20 pm
@Joshy phil,
Sorrow is not revenge its sadness..I feel sorry for the child whose life is unfulfilled, i feel sorry for their parents and family, i feel sorrow for Catch and for myself..I feel sorrow for the mad fool whose life ended when he contemplated this awful dead ..Sorrow joins us as humans, revenge is the inability to understand..
 
Bones-O
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:26 pm
@Joshy phil,
Joshy wrote:

I don't think that, no matter what people do, revenge is the answer. Torturing somebody like that would surely make you as bad as, or worse than, them.

Believing it good that wrongdoers have the promise of death and torture to look forward to does seem absurd, doesn't it? I wonder how it ever caught on...
 
Joshy phil
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 01:44 pm
@Bones-O,
Well, in a scenario such as this one, where the wrongdoer suffers from psychological problems, it would surely be more righteous to try and help him with his problems, rather than shoot him a few times. Where would that get us?

Sorrow is understandable, but can also be dangerous. It can tip people to the edge sometimes, and can so easily lead to revenge. That is why it is important to both control your emotions to a degree, and think about the what the wrongdoer did and possible reasons why they may have conducted such an act.
 
Catchabula
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 02:01 pm
@Joshy phil,
Joshy wrote:
Well, in a scenario such as this one, where the wrongdoer suffers from psychological problems, it would surely be more righteous to try and help him with his problems, rather than shoot him a few times. Where would that get us?

Sorrow is understandable, but can also be dangerous. It can tip people to the edge sometimes, and can so easily lead to revenge. That is why it is important to both control your emotions to a degree, and think about the what the wrongdoer did and possible reasons why they may have conducted such an act.


Wrong answer too I fear (forgive me my boldness). The criteria of "understanding" and "possible reasons" hardly being applicable to such monstreous acts. This kind of crimes seems almost too huge for justice, yet fair justice is the only answer we have. But a thorough examination of the whole drama is of course imperative. It has just started over here...
 
Joshy phil
 
Reply Sun 25 Jan, 2009 03:43 pm
@Catchabula,
Catchabula wrote:
Wrong answer too I fear (forgive me my boldness). The criteria of "understanding" and "possible reasons" hardly being applicable to such monstreous acts. This kind of crimes seems almost too huge for justice, yet fair justice is the only answer we have. But a thorough examination of the whole drama is of course imperative. It has just started over here...

I understand what you mean,and it is highly unlikely that there was any kind of reasoning at all, let alone justifiable. However, I just get the feeling that somebody wouldn't consciously go out of their way simply to slaughter young children. In my mind, it doesn't add up.
This probably sounds completely wrong, and it wasn't even an immediate thought of mine upon hearing the news, but perhaps it is sometimes right to sympathise with somebody who had inflicted such a wound upon the world. I only say this because, as I previously mentioned, I cannot think why anybody would act in that way consciously, and so therefore a mental problem could have driven them to it...?

I'm not entirely sure what to think in this case. Either way, nobody else seems inclined to my way of thinking, so perhaps I have got it all wrong. But from what I know of being charged as guilty for a crime, somebody has to have the incentive and the guilty conscience. If somebody, however, were not to understand the consequences of their actions, or even somehow not be aware of what they were doing, then how are you meant to treat them? What is the suitable justice for that person?
 
 

 
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