not without my sisters

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Reply Sat 7 Jul, 2007 12:45 pm
not without my sisters
just a small note to say i ahve just read this book and not only did i cry all the way through i also came to realise that so many innocent children grow up in a world of fear and as a mother of 3 i found this hard to comprehend.
no amount of words could express my admiration for all of you who have managed to break free and make a life for yourselves and for never giving up on bringing your abusers to justice.
i feel so much for you all and if there ANY way i could help just ask.
i dont belive and have never believed in god (just my own opninon) but i do believe that what goes aroung comes around.
take care all x family
 
evanman
 
Reply Fri 20 Jul, 2007 08:50 am
Paedophiles are found in all walks of life. Some use religion as a cover for gaining access to children. There is a case of a school head teacher who was guilty.

The most horrendous thing is that CoG/TF cynically used religion to justify this perversion. For me this is not proof for the non-existence of God. In Communist regimes we have seen examples. In Nicaragua the Sandinista leader Daniel Ortega has been accused by his own step-daughter.

Cases in Romania were frequent during the Ceascescu era. Basically, anywhere where children are in vulnerable positions they are prey to human greed and deviance.
 
Cookie 2
 
Reply Thu 26 Jul, 2007 07:24 pm
read this book in two sittings. fantastic. would tell anyone with an interest in this type topic to buy it. reading it, i felt like someone had ghostwritten my own story, especially Celeste's part. kudos to these girls who were brave enough to come out in the open, even if it may hurt people they still love. the truth is the truth. i wish i had their guts.
 
tyciol 2
 
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2007 08:24 am
This is NOT an issue of pedophilia. It is an issue of people brainwashing people to believe they have to have sex. It's not about sex being immoral, or children having sex being immoral. It's about destroying their free will and making them feel obligated to serve other people's whims and lust instead of following their own hearts.
 
mrs reaper
 
Reply Thu 23 Aug, 2007 03:18 pm
tyciol why are you so determined to stand up for sick perverts?? it is pedophillia i have read the book and it is plain sick, noone can say that it is alright for adults to molest babies and children brainwashing and grooming IS PEDOPHILIA which is what they did. children having sex IS IMMORAL there bodies are not ready for it physically or emotionaly
 
Cookie 2
 
Reply Fri 24 Aug, 2007 08:29 pm
Tyciol, i can tell you that what i experienced (so simillar to what Celeste went thru) WAS pedophillia and was hurtful not only at the time, but which left scars and fears with me that were carried into adulthood. Pedophillia is always wrong!
 
Anonymous
 
Reply Mon 3 Mar, 2008 04:00 pm
Re: not without my sisters
i have also just read this book which is how i have ended up on this site, i was horrified by what i read and am amazed that a religious cult such as this has been allowed to carry on.
i have done alot of reading about the COG the last week or so and cant beleive some of what i read.
the main thing that sticks in my mind tho, is that of the 3 children that grew up closest to david berg. two are dead, one through suicide and the other through something not far off.
i think that just about speaks volumes.
i feel deeply sorry for all those that suffered and as a parent myself i am mortified that parents of these children allowed things like the abuse etc to go on, turning a blind eye.and in some cases even condoning this behaviour
i only hope that many of the children that suffered at the hands of these evil, twisted delusional people have been able to move on and have better lives, normal relaitionships and find happiness.
 
silentnight
 
Reply Mon 31 Mar, 2008 05:20 pm
Re: not without my sisters
like mrs reaper i looked up the site because of the book Not Without My Sisters
of all the books ive read this is proving the hardest to read, it reminds me much of my own childhood
i understand your anger, no im not just saying it, I Understand
 
debra 2
 
Reply Tue 20 May, 2008 09:44 am
Re: not without my sisters
I have just finished reading this book which has left me tearful and devastated with the conditions these poor children survived.
As with other readers of this book, I was urged to join this site to read other testimonies of children that had endured the same experiences. I am almost shell shocked by the hideous acts of paedophilia that occured and were condoned by parents of innocent children.
I have questions swirling round in my head such as; 'were these adults really brainwashed or did they plead ignorance to their children because they were also involved in the torture and molestation of other people's children in 'the family'.
Cults such as this are the stem of atheism as people with doubts about their beliefs can be completely disilusioned by cults that abuse religion to these extremes.
If there is anything I can do to help survivors that are still scarred from these horrific ordeals I would be much obliged. I will always be here to listen and give the best advice to anyone who would like to talk about their fears. As a newly qualified counsellor, I would be happy to donate my time to help anyone to 'heal their wounds'.
I offer my deepest condolensces to all those that endured this abuse.
May your future lives be filled with hope and happiness.
 
Arssle
 
Reply Fri 23 May, 2008 10:44 am
Re:
Cookie wrote:
Tyciol, i can tell you that what i experienced (so simillar to what Celeste went thru) WAS pedophillia and was hurtful not only at the time, but which left scars and fears with me that were carried into adulthood. Pedophillia is always wrong!

I guess what he was trying to say was: every one knows it's wrong, so why would they do it? They're brainwashed into thinking it's ok. I think that should be the main issue too. Without the constant brainwashing there wouldn't be any pædophelia (or probably not as much). And the family isn't the only example of this. Scientology, as amazing as it sounds is guilty of the same thing, check this out. http://www.exscientologykids.com/seaorg.html
 
Cookie 2
 
Reply Fri 23 May, 2008 02:26 pm
Re: not without my sisters
being brainwashed into committing murder still makes murder wrong.
being brainwashed into having sex with your own child is wrong. and has been tabboo for thousands of years in many cultures.
is no excuse to commit acts that in your previous life you were aware were wrong. these adults were not born into TFI society. they joined after they became old enuf to do so legally. they knew full well what was right and what was wrong.
 
Arssle
 
Reply Sat 31 May, 2008 03:05 am
Re: not without my sisters
Cookie wrote:
being brainwashed into committing murder still makes murder wrong.
being brainwashed into having sex with your own child is wrong. and has been tabboo for thousands of years in many cultures.
is no excuse to commit acts that in your previous life you were aware were wrong. these adults were not born into TFI society. they joined after they became old enuf to do so legally. they knew full well what was right and what was wrong.

You guys are probably gonna hate this but here goes. Of course it's wrong, but the truth is they might not have done it if they hadn't been brainwashed to begin with. First of all let's start with the definition of the term "Brainwashing". it is instilling certain attitudes and beliefs in a person. Those beliefs are sometimes in conflict with the person's prior beliefs and knowledge. ok so we have a person, just joined the family, lets say; that person will have certain views of right and wrong... the world in general before he or she joins. Now if you go to that person and say right from the start: "pedophilia is the way to go", that person will immediately back off and probably think "Whoa, that's fucked up." (most likely think that). Now take that same person and at first say something about how love is the answer to all their problems they'll think "these guys cool... different, let's see what happens, they could be right.", after that you tell them they need to love jesus because we're grateful he saved us or something, they'll go and do it. now we have to give the love jeus gave us to other because that's what jesus wants "ok, way to go". next thing, "why not demonstrate that love sexually? After all what better way to say I love you to a person than to fuck em', huh?" the guy says "you're right." does it, etc. now you say "kids need "love" too": by this time he'll be so brainwashed into thinking he's doing it for jesus that he'll do it without a second thought about it being wrong or even illegal for that matter. his mentality is so twisted that he'll probably even commit murder and think he's doing it for jesus, if they told him to (see Muslim extremists). The sad fact is, the guy now has a totally different view of what's right and wrong (morally speaking) and that the brainwashing was so subtle that he thinks he does it out of his own free will. Who is more to blame, the guy who does it, or the guy who brainwashes him into thinking it's ok to do it? Hell, every one in the family is brainwashed into thinking there is no better environment than the family, that the world outside is godless, cruel and cold and that, even if the family is a "little weird or even bad for you... it would be worse for you if you left". now you can start telling me to fuck off.
 
Cookie 2
 
Reply Sat 31 May, 2008 08:49 am
Re: not without my sisters
I don't think you have to tell those of us born in the family about brainwashing and how it works. in our own hindsight of our own brainwashings, we probably understand it better than many experts.

i hold to what i was saying.

brainwashing is NOT A GOOD EXCUSE! in fact, it's no excuse at all for the generation who imposed things on us because they knew about more than what was going on at the time in the family. they'd been born and raised in society at large and definately knew better.
 
Anonymous
 
Reply Wed 18 Jun, 2008 07:31 am
Re: not without my sisters
This book is a very emotional read,ive never read or heard anything quite like it and want to show my support in some way and this is the only way i feel i can.As a mother of three boys it sickens me to know that there are children within these religious cults who are being abused and stripped of thier innocence.throughout my life i have had to accept the knowledge that my own mother was abused by my grandad so i am very familiar with the affects this has on a person and the persons close family.im glad people are realising that the children of god or the family is an evil organisation and one not to get involved with at any cost.

i cannot believe that the family have got a lovely web site on the world wide web and why organisations such as these that have been well documented for abusing vulnerable adults and children are given permissions to be on the net,it disgusts me and angers me,i feel im going to continue this journey and try to put a stop to things like the families officail website being published on the web.

if anyone knows where to begin please post anything that would be of help for my mission to get these people off here so that the internet is safer and less influencial to vulnerable people.

to the three sisters who wrote the book thank you for sharing this sad part of your lives with me,i respect what you are doing and your willingness to become better people through discovering real love.

sandra xx
 
tyciol 2
 
Reply Tue 8 Jul, 2008 11:58 pm
Re:
mrs reaper wrote:
tyciol why are you so determined to stand up for sick perverts?? it is pedophillia i have read the book and it is plain sick, noone can say that it is alright for adults to molest babies and children brainwashing and grooming IS PEDOPHILIA which is what they did. children having sex IS IMMORAL there bodies are not ready for it physically or emotionaly
I'm not sure why you're saying I'm standing up for the Family's actions. I said "It's about destroying their free will and making them feel obligated to serve other people's whims and lust instead of following their own hearts." Does that sound like I'm standing up for them?

I just don't care if they are perverts. Perversion isn't wrong, it's just different. The family might be perverted, but it's wrong because it has controlling policies and spreads what I think is isolationist propoganda, not because of being perverted. There are plenty of 'sick' people I don't think are a threat to anyone. I honestly wouldn't even call it a sickness, to me it actually seems very consciously contemplated on the part of the men leading this. As for others who legitimately believe in it, it's not the result of a spontaneous sickness, but by being guided by those above telling them the way things are. It's not any more 'sick' than people believing in religions based on the words of pastors and other family members.

What the main problem is is that this religion is more expansionist and extremist than other ones and goes a step further doing some things which are more alarming to people.

Cookie wrote:
Tyciol, i can tell you that what i experienced (so simillar to what Celeste went thru) WAS pedophillia and was hurtful not only at the time, but which left scars and fears with me that were carried into adulthood. Pedophillia is always wrong!
No it's not. It's not right or wrong, it's a condition. There is nothing about it which necessitates hurt or scars or fear. What you are describing sounds like molestation, manipulation, rape, abuse. Those words are more proper to describe what I am presuming you are refering to.

Cookie wrote:
being brainwashed into committing murder still makes murder wrong. being brainwashed into having sex with your own child is wrong. and has been tabboo for thousands of years in many cultures.
is no excuse to commit acts that in your previous life you were aware were wrong. these adults were not born into TFI society. they joined after they became old enuf to do so legally. they knew full well what was right and what was wrong.
No, it doesn't. Murder is inherantly wrong, it isn't 'made wrong' by anything. I think what you meant to say was 'being brainwashed should not excuse immoral actions'. Being brainwashed into doing or thinking ANYTHING is wrong, there's no need to be specific. Taboos are utterly irrelevant, taboos do not determine what is right and wrong. Most people are not 'aware' of wrong, because wrong is a matter of opinion, not a matter of knowledge or fact. Essentially what happens, is people may believe that, but due to simply believing it due to being told it is wrong, they have not contemplated the matter for themself. Due to this, when they are confronted with their lack of thought on the matter, they naturally reject the opinion they were pressured into accepting (even if it was the right one) and look for an opinion they can call their own (even if they are lead to concluding it based on manipulative elders). People do not inherantly know what is right or wrong simply because they were adults beforehand, and even so they can be led to (or spontaneously) change their minds on various issues over time.
 
Konzervativka
 
Reply Thu 1 Jul, 2010 03:50 am
Re: not without my sisters
I have also read the book just recently, i wonder how i havent come across it before. The whole story was sickening me more with every page i read further, i immidiately started to talk about it with some of my friends trying to describe what i read but there are no such words to fully describe these horrors. I cant even imagine living and being brought up in such environment.. I started reserching the background on the internet, found TF wesite which almost made me puke, and then i realised that they are also active here in Slovenia where i live. Frightening!
I think the real problem is that every government is trying to come out tolerant so they dont interfere with different religious communities and their lifestyle because it immidiately looks like they are discriminating them. If anything goes the way it should i am going to start my studies to be a social worker in fall, hopefully in a few years i will be the one openly prosecuting TF in my country. Those bastards are concentrating on those who are handycap or those with lower social standard because they are easy targets.
Otherwise congrats to all those who had the chance to be "reborn" if i may sound a little ironic i hope all goes well for you despite what u have all been through. What doesnt kill you makes u stronger..remember that it works. By being successful in "the system" u proove to them that they have failed and you can try to protect others from getting involved with such madness. Take care all of you.. Bye
 
Anonymous
 
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 06:50 am
Re: not without my sisters
Having grown up in the group I lived a very simular childhood to that of these three sisters, in fact, I met Celeste in Bangkok at one point. It is important that the errors the group made in the past are not forgotten even though the group would like it to disappear. Abuse happened and it happened to most of us first generation born in the group before the 1990 years. My 4 older brothers and I were abused mentally, physically and sexually for a period of quite a few years...the mental abuse continued albeit for a longer period. I am now writing my own autobiography to tell my story, I feel that is the only way I can let go completely and move on. Being that the group admitted their errors of the past perhaps they should be obligated to pay for counseling and therapy sessions for their victims?
 
tea73
 
Reply Wed 16 Mar, 2011 07:02 pm
@tyciol 2,
I disagree. The scores of predators I came across in the family were all cut from the same cloth. There was no difference between them and my mother's previous violent, sexually depraved pedophile ex that she ran from strait into the hellish arms of the family. My mother recruited a replacement shortly after her induction into the cult. He chose to embrace it all, particularly having fun with little girls. Eventually he came to disagree with some of the "principles", namely having to share his wife with johns and any/all male family members AND not having sole control over his little harem. He left the family, but continued to have his fun. Once a pedophile ALWAYS a pedophile. If you can go through with sexual assault of a child, regardless of what bullshit has been shoved down your throat, you are a predator and there is something inherently sick in your soul. I think I'm qualified to make that statement considering the WIDE and ASSORTED array of sexual predators that I've encountered throughout my life. God help the next one that crosses my path.
 
sparkle1984
 
Reply Thu 26 May, 2011 01:19 pm
@mrs reaper,
I too have read Not Without My Sisters and I would also like to offer my deepest sympathies with all the children who have been brought into or born into this cult and abused. It is totally shocking that more was not done to stop Berg and his cronies and it is a despicable abuse of religion on any level to use it as an excuse for the levels of abuse that went on, and may still be going on for all we really know. As a mother of four myself the mere idea that the parents of these children could possibly think that what they were allowing to happen to the children, theirs and others, is completely alien to me. The ladies that wrote this book should be commended for their bravery and the perpetrators of the abuse should be brought to justice, although I doubt they will in this lifetime. I hope that David Berg is rotting in Hell.
 
artsychicks
 
Reply Fri 15 Jul, 2011 12:06 pm
@mrs reaper,
Not believing in God isn't something I have been left with... it is something I struggle with on a daily basis but, I have come to realize everything I learned was skewed by Mo and Maria. It's still difficult but, it hasn't meant I have lost all faith. I was in Los Angeles California in an off sect of the "family" and our experiences had a lot more to do with sex trafficking "flirty fishing" and violence. Not many know of offsets that were kept after Mo was made to leave the US. It wasn't pretty here either. It wasn't all high end and roses as Julianna or Celeste may have seen it while they were in CA.
Children weren't always seen as a blessing. They were often seen as pure and therefore from the scriptures as a sacrificial lamb.
 
 

 
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