8 Characteristics of True Humanity

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Reply Wed 19 Mar, 2008 01:53 pm
Well hello and good day to all! This topic is another idea in the realm of spiritual philosophical thought. Based on philosophy and theology in harmony that gives us spiritual philosophy. The religious related topic here is "True Humanity." How does that apply to spirituality? Easy for a human to be a human we have souls which is the real you. Now our soul is our real selves and our spirit is the inner man. To really be a human you have to be in touch with your self (soul) and develop your spirit (spiritual) and have characteristics that are compatable with our intended nature. Our intended nature or our intended state was demonstrated by the biblical Yeshua/JC. He set the bar for humanity and was truly human. Now this is no doctrine or even a principle in the world of religion. This is just a spiritual philosophy of what true humanity is based on his character with the appliance of philosophy.

These 8 characteristics are what we should ideally want to have and resemble in everday life. They are in no particular significance.


1. Humility (humility builds character pride detriments it, where as when you are humble you are tamed and lowly to others pride you rely on other's opinion to be better than them or find yourself a person of strife who argues alot or always trying to prove others wrong and superficiality inside since pride is sometimes a inaccurate opinion of one self.) Remember the more humble you are the stronger you become (spiritually) Why? Pride rely's on others opinions or thoughts. Humility rely's on doing the right thing without effect from peoples' opinion or thoughts. That's strength! This does not mean you hurt others it means you don't rely on them for your strength.

2. Equality Treat others how you want to be treated, no better no less. It is writen not to be a respecter of persons which we should do because regardless of status,fame, and money we are all just the same black.white..yellow..we are all human and deserve equality in humanity regardless.

3. Nobility This one is truly human. In the face of horror some people can be so noble. It's defined as morally and or mentally excellant. This would mean you don't stoop to people's level at making harsh comments when they strike you you turn the other cheek again this is what the Lord taught. Nobility is something humans are most notable for in times of horror. See 9/11 how common people rushed to the scene of diaster and not away to try and save others this is just one example.

4. Integrity This is defined as adherence to moral and ethical principles. Integrity by far is the most rare quality in people of fame and fortune. The reason for this is because these people place fame and fortune above values and principles and some even compromise their character to get it. See pornography as one example. Integrity is something that is becomming more and more rare in televangelists for example as they are popping up in the news with some of the things that are morally outrageous and ethically wrong. See televangelists who commit to prostitution or clergy who molests children.

5. Companionship The word says there is no greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends. A man's best friend is usually a dog because the dog is always loyal to him even to the point of death! Loyalty to your friends and complete strangers is true companionship. When someone is stranded at the side of the road you give them a ride into town. When someone is in trouble you risk your life to save them. When someone is $1 short you pay it forward. When you talk about your friends it is not gossip or hate speech it is positive and encouraging that is true companionship and being loyal to your fellow man even to the point of death.

6. Compliant One that should not be common among religious advents sadly it is. Few people have I met that are compliant with God's Laws, their parents rules, or the legal system. Most people are instead complacent instead of compliant and this is not a good state of humanity to be in folks. Complacency is commonplace in religious society this should not be! Complacency is satisfying oneself with consumerism,indulgence,etc. It is being satisfied with one's situation unaware of potential danger. This is especially true in individuals who are scholars',rabbis',preachors', and pastors'. They rationalize their works will get them into heaven or their ministry but what they need to realize is they are being spiritually complacent and should be spiritually compliant. Compliant is complying with GOD's Law and standards while not relying on it for salvation or redemption. Many people do that but there is a balance that you are compliant for the sake of obeying and rely on other factors for salvation,redeemption/forgiveness,.

7. Heroism is defined as the qualities or attributes of a hero.
A hero is a man of distinguished courage or ability, admired for his brave deeds and noble qualities. This quality is very popular in hollywood for puffing it up with superheros and whatnot you have all seen them. However a true hero is not a superhero. A true hero is someone who has conquered all fear of man,death,horror,pain, etc. They're only fear is fear of GOD that is a true hero. Have you ever heard of champions of faith? Take the biblical story of David he killed a Giant probably twice his size because he feared GOD and not a mere man. Remember Hercules? He was the size of a human with super strength. Remember it's not the size of the hero that matters it's the size of his GOD. Believe it or not Humility gives us great strength some people often see pride as strength but that is a lie! The reason why humility gives us great strength is because when you are humble you will do the right thing regardless of whether you are pleasing others. Pride you are concerned with other's opinions and rely's on them! So many people are fearful of man and man's action whether they have power means nothing. What matters is again who their GOD is. If their GOD is themself they are certainly no hero if others view them as a hero their strength can only be measured by others but if they're strength is in the Living GOD and they are humble they have what it takes to be a true hero.

8. Truthfulness This is one is huge! Can I say how huge! To be a true human one must be truthful! Honest, sincere, not fake or a make-believer but a true individual. A seeker of truth or a student of truth. Truthfullness is so crucial to being truly human because to be truly human one must know the truth!

I hope this has been helpful folks. What do you think 8 characteristics of humanity are? I am not saying this is set in stone there is many characteristics to humanity but I believe these are necessary to be truly human. Why 8? Well 8 is the number of the new man as Dustin said so being as out with the old and in with the new the number of 8 seems to fit.
 
Aedes
 
Reply Wed 19 Mar, 2008 03:38 pm
@Israelite007,
Sounds like a good list of ideals, though my fundamental disagreement with you (as always) is that I don't feel God is necessary for any of these. I've asked you many times and you've never really answered, so I'll ask again -- how do you account for good, kind, noble, heroic people who don't believe in God? If it's possible to do ALL of the actions and live ALL the ideals you espouse, and yet actvely and self-consciously NOT believe in God, then clearly God is not necessary.

Anyway, don't you think that, in a way, all 8 of these can stem from the same underlying mentality or character?


Speaking of groups of 8, how do you feel about the noble eightfold path, Israelite? It is the basic code of morals in Buddhism:

http://hometown.aol.com/fburggraf/images/8foldpath.gif
 
Justin
 
Reply Wed 19 Mar, 2008 04:22 pm
@Israelite007,
Israelite, please read the 5 Laws of Success. You'll find it most interesting.

Question... Why do people think they have to fear God? Is that something that Jesus taught? I'm asking because I've heard it before and it is really puzzling. We may just as well fear ourselves and our neighbor too if Fearing God is means being a hero.

Quote:
A true hero is someone who has conquered all fear of man,death,horror,pain, etc. They're only fear is fear of GOD that is a true hero. Have you ever heard of champions of faith? Take the biblical story of David he killed a Giant probably twice his size because he feared GOD and not a mere man.
Nothing good comes out of fear... NOTHING. Why would we want to fear God?... as I understand it's a desire of some to actually fear creation. If God is Love, then why then would we make heros out of those that fear LOVE. Does this make sense? Sometimes I can be rather logical but it would seem a religious man would embrace God rather than fear God.

Read the 5 Laws of Success and tell me what you think.
 
Aedes
 
Reply Wed 19 Mar, 2008 05:09 pm
@Israelite007,
Good point, Justin. I missed that part of the post.

I think fear should be embraced. Fear, in a way, is what allows us to take things seriously and do things well.
 
Didymos Thomas
 
Reply Wed 19 Mar, 2008 05:38 pm
@Israelite007,
Quote:
I think fear should be embraced. Fear, in a way, is what allows us to take things seriously and do things well.


Sometimes fear can produce these results, but I'm not sure we should conclude that fear should be embraced. If we only act out of fear, we miss any positive motivation in acting. For example, if I work really hard at my job because I'm afraid of my boss, this added productivity will ultimately cause me harm because I only acted out of fear. If I work hard at my job because I want to provide well for my family, I can be proud of my hard work and effort.

As for the 8 characteristics, I would object to "Compliant". Do not get me wrong, I'm all about the Confucian value of respect for the family and all of that. But I do not think that simply following the rules because they are the rules is appropriate. What if the law is unjust, or unjustly applied?
 
Aedes
 
Reply Wed 19 Mar, 2008 06:45 pm
@Israelite007,
Just depends how broadly you apply the word "fear", which can encompass many different concepts. Kind of like the word "suffering" in Buddhism, which doesn't really mean the same thing in other contexts.
 
dancinginchains
 
Reply Wed 19 Mar, 2008 07:07 pm
@Israelite007,
I suppose then that Falseness would be a huge characteristic for False Humanity.

I had to chuckle a bit when I read this because I figured it kind of goes without saying when referring to True Humanity.

That said though, good list. You've established the fundamentals well in a very comprehensible (sp?) fashion. Though I would have worded some parts a bit different I can't find a whole lot I disagree with here.
 
Israelite007
 
Reply Thu 20 Mar, 2008 08:56 am
@dancinginchains,
dancinginchains wrote:
I suppose then that Falseness would be a huge characteristic for False Humanity.

I had to chuckle a bit when I read this because I figured it kind of goes without saying when referring to True Humanity.

That said though, good list. You've established the fundamentals well in a very comprehensible (sp?) fashion. Though I would have worded some parts a bit different I can't find a whole lot I disagree with here.


Yeah it goes without saying but I chuckled how you mentioned falsehood was a huge characteristic in False Humanity. Excellent point dancingchains.

Hey Aedes nice post.

I feel strongly toward the 8-fold path. It's a nice model but is there more to it? if there is it can more be clearly defined WHAT the right effort is what the right purpose is and so on. There may be more than one right answer to a puzzle. Life is a puzzle and many people piece parts together and say it is finished however they have only pieced one scene to an entire landscape and for them to say this is right then they are missing the bigger picture.

As for the GOD question it's a good question. I am not sure I have an answer that will satisfy you. However, I don't think humanity can work without the GOD equation. There has to be some form of belief or religion in order for humanity to move forward. As for the answer let me say if there was a person who had no belief in GOD and wanted to have 8 characteristics of true humanity could they? Sure, but it would be based on their understanding or philosophy.

So whatever we say may not make much of an impact to that type of individual but my purpose of this post is that is to show that humanity cannot work without the GOD equation and no human should be self-reliant or self-dependent. It is my belief to be truly human one must depend on a true source for their identity. Without knowing the One True GOD they could be living a false identity which may not benefit them spiritually.

Hey Justin Nice reference I am interested in checking that out. I will check back when I have read the entire thing. You brought up a good point on fear though. Well one reason why people should fear GOD is because it's a commandment. another reason is that he is the source of power,love, and energy so we should fear him because he is our maker.

Have you ever heard your heart beat? I am sure you have try it some time. when it's quiet put your hand on your chest and listen to your heartbeat. Now think whatever man, beast or spiritual force can do to you it has nothing on your heart. Just think these other forces try to damage or heal your heart but can they create one? No Hashem made man's heart and we should fear him above all things because no matter what they do to us it is only bodily harm. Remember that because we should fear him not in a bad way that we are afraid of his judgment or punishment we are not fearing him. To fear him is to revere him and to fear him is to let go of fear of anything for he is Sovereign. This is a constructive and healthy fear since it drives us to do great things.

Imagine if you will a person who has no GOD and relies merely on their will. Let's say they fear death and fear man. They go their whole life trying to live as long as they can as healthy as they can and as happy as they can but because they fear man they are trying to please their peers and are overly submissive to authority that is stronger than they more powerful than they or richer than they so they will have little happiness. So they spend some of their life trying to be stronger, more powerful and more rich so they can overcome their fear of man. Now because they did this without realizing it they die young, stressed, and happily poor because of their fears. Did they maximize their potential? No.

Now if you fear Hashem with a good kind of fear it will take you to your maximum potential as a human and you will actually do things MOST humans wouldn't dare. Like say you are sky diving. You take your first leap because you want to know what it's like to take risks and subdue unhealthy fears. You land shortly after and decide it wasn't fear that made you jump it was faith.

When we begin to realize that we should never hold back because of fear we learn to leap out in faith knowing we are going to land eventually but because we have our GOD he will be waiting right there to catch us when we fall.
 
Aedes
 
Reply Thu 20 Mar, 2008 09:19 am
@Israelite007,
Israelite007 wrote:
I feel strongly toward the 8-fold path. It's a nice model but is there more to it? if there is it can more be clearly defined WHAT the right effort is what the right purpose is and so on.
Oh there's plenty. Didymos Thomas may know better than I, but people have been discussing this for more than 2000 years. I'll see if I can find something interesting to share about it.

Quote:
I don't think humanity can work without the GOD equation. there has to be some form of belief or religion in order for humanity to move forward. As for the answer let me say if there was a person who had no belief in GOD and wanted to have 8 characteristics of true humanity could they? sure. but it would be based on their understanding or philosophy. So whatever we say may not make much of an impact to that type of individual but my purpose of this post is that is to show that humanity cannot work without the GOD equation and no human should be self-reliant or self-dependant. It is my belief to be truly human one must depend on a true source for their identity. Without knowing the One True GOD they could be living a false identity which may not benefit them spiritually.
Could it be that God serves a certain role for you that for others is not fulfilled by God? In other words, we have certain inclinations and instincts that God can satisfy for some people, but he's not necessary in people who fulfill those needs otherwise?
 
Didymos Thomas
 
Reply Thu 20 Mar, 2008 03:53 pm
@Aedes,
The Noble Eight Fold Path is probably best understood in relation to the Four Noble Truths.

The First Noble Truth is the truth of suffering, or dis-ease, irritation, dissatisfaction (dukkha): clinging (upadana) to the five aggregates is suffering. These five are: 1) Form and Matter, the physical world around you and your physical body 2) Sensation, pleasant, displeasing, or neutral 3) Perception or Cognition, registers whether an object is recognized or not, like the sound of a bell or the shape of a tree 4) Volition, our mental habits, thoughts, ideas, compulsions, and decisions triggered by some object and 5) Cognizance, the base that supports all existence.

The Second is the Origin of Suffering: craving for sensual pleasure, existence, or non-existence occurs (tahna) because of our clinging (upadana) to the five aggregates causes renewed existence (Bhava). Bhava is the desire for more sensation, for more life.

The Third is the Cessation of Suffering: is cultivating the indwelling Buddha Nature in all beings. Cessation of craving, and not clinging to self, or non-self.

The Fourth is The Noble Truth of the Way: the way to the cessation of suffering is the Noble Eightfold Path.

Clinging (upadana) to the five aggregates is suffering (dukkha). Craving (tahna) because of clinging (upadana) causes renewed existence (Bhava). Bhava is accompanied by craving (tahna).

And yes, this is all circular. Samsara is the term for this cycle of suffering - the cycle of birth/rebirth, Bhava, which allows for craving, which allows for clinging which allows for suffering. Following the Eightfold Path is the way out of Samsara.

I included the sanskrit terms used in Buddhist literature as best I could so that if some clarification is needed, you can look up the actual Buddhist terminology.

Now for the Eightfold Path:

The Eight are divided into three categories:

Wisdom: mental and cognitive aspects of the practice
1) Right View - understanding, especially of the Four Noble Truths. Right view is necessary for the rest of the Path. As expected, wrong view, or ignorance, will lead to wrong intention, ect.
2) Right Intention - proper exertion of our own will to change. From canon 'And what is right thought? Being resolved on renunciation, on freedom from ill will, on harmlessness: This is called right thought.'

Ethical Conduct: From canon 'It is in the nature of things that freedom from remorse arises in a person endowed with virtue, consummate in virtue.' But, of course, we should not cling to virtue.
3) Right Speech - making the best use of our words. Being honest, not being abusive in speech, and refraining from mindless, idle chatter.
4) Right Action - Not destroying sentient beings, not stealing, abstaining from sexual misconduct.
5) Right livelihood - practitioners ought not to engage in occupations which, directly or indirectly, hurt other sentient beings

Mental Discipline: the best way to go about shaping the practitioners outlook on the world for the practitioner
6) Right effort - right endeavor, engaging in effort that is wholesome in terms of karma, karma being the ultimate consequences of the effort to the agent
7) Right mindfulness - paying attention to all phenomena that affect the body and mind. Being attentive to the present moment, open, quiet and alert.
8) Right concentration - right concentration is dependent on all other parts of the path. Right concentration is a singleness of mind when equipped with all the other factors.

I hope I haven't made any of that too confusing.
 
Justin
 
Reply Thu 20 Mar, 2008 04:56 pm
@Israelite007,
Israelite007 wrote:
So whatever we say may not make much of an impact to that type of individual but my purpose of this post is that is to show that humanity cannot work without the GOD equation and no human should be self-reliant or self-dependent. It is my belief to be truly human one must depend on a true source for their identity. Without knowing the One True GOD they could be living a false identity which may not benefit them spiritually.

The above is your assertion based on your own perception which is in effect, limited by your recent involvement in Religion, your age, experience... etc etc. I'm not trying to be critical but in the response above your refer to God as God and below this in your response to myself, you refer to God as Hashem. It almost seems as though you are jumping on any bandwagon that comes along, reading it and then trying to repeat this information to people in this forum... without the experience of it.

Take some time to soak up what you learn read and take some time to grow and discuss it without the element of preaching it. Most of us you are trying to explain these things to are twice your age and have experienced similar to what you are experiencing now.

Israelite007 wrote:
Hey Justin Nice reference I am interested in checking that out. I will check back when I have read the entire thing. You brought up a good point on fear though. Well one reason why people should fear GOD is because it's a commandment. another reason is that he is the source of power,love, and energy so we should fear him because he is our maker.

I'm not sure about the commandment part of it but fearing God because he is our maker, makes no sense to me at all.

Israelite007 wrote:
Have you ever heard your heart beat? I am sure you have try it some time. when it's quiet put your hand on your chest and listen to your heartbeat. Now think whatever man, beast or spiritual force can do to you it has nothing on your heart. Just think these other forces try to damage or heal your heart but can they create one? No Hashem made man's heart and we should fear him above all things because no matter what they do to us it is only bodily harm. Remember that because we should fear him not in a bad way that we are afraid of his judgment or punishment we are not fearing him. To fear him is to revere him and to fear him is to let go of fear of anything for he is Sovereign. This is a constructive and healthy fear since it drives us to do great things.


This again is preaching. I want explanations that can be understood by anyone. No need to sit here and preach something you don't necessarily understand yourself.

First of all, nothing does great things in fear. You don't understand this and I'm not about to go into explanations on this but there is no such thing as positive fear and positive growth in fear. Someday you'll understand why when you are ready.

Israelite007 wrote:
Imagine if you will a person who has no GOD and relies merely on their will. Let's say they fear death and fear man. They go their whole life trying to live as long as they can as healthy as they can and as happy as they can but because they fear man they are trying to please their peers and are overly submissive to authority that is stronger than they more powerful than they or richer than they so they will have little happiness. So they spend some of their life trying to be stronger, more powerful and more rich so they can overcome their fear of man. Now because they did this without realizing it they die young, stressed, and happily poor because of their fears. Did they maximize their potential? No.


Again, the above doesn't make sense at all nor does it resonate with my reasoning. You are trying to tell me about something you haven't necessarily experienced.

Israelite007 wrote:
Now if you fear Hashem with a good kind of fear it will take you to your maximum potential as a human and you will actually do things MOST humans wouldn't dare. Like say you are sky diving. You take your first leap because you want to know what it's like to take risks and subdue unhealthy fears. You land shortly after and decide it wasn't fear that made you jump it was faith.


Here you begin using the word Hashem rather than God. Not sure why exactly but for conversation purposes, keep it simple. Good kind of fear and human maximum potential... I know you mean well and appreciate your desire to be involved but you've lost me again here.

Israelite007 wrote:
When we begin to realize that we should never hold back because of fear we learn to leap out in faith knowing we are going to land eventually but because we have our GOD he will be waiting right there to catch us when we fall.


How do you KNOW this? Catch yourself when you fall! If you wait for God, you'll keep falling. Just sky dive out of a plane with no parachute and you'll see exactly what I mean. - an example, not literal

Any further, I cannot converse back and forth with anyone who is attempting to preach. There are plenty of preachers out there who preach things they themselves don't even understand so please don't join that rank. However, while the original post has some good points, the follow up is something that has lost my interest all together.

If you'd like to discuss things and get others opinions on some of these things and then form your own conclusion on these things, that's what this forum is all about. We all discuss and learn from each other without preaching at each other.

If I sound rash, I don't mean to be. The intent is not to discourage you here but preaching is highly discouraged. We all experience this excitement and want to tell the world. Just be yourself and please refrain from preaching to us!

I do hope you read the Russell stuff, I think you'll enjoy it.

Peace!
 
Aristoddler
 
Reply Thu 20 Mar, 2008 07:07 pm
@Israelite007,
The biggest problem with having faith is the failure to question it.
 
dancinginchains
 
Reply Fri 21 Mar, 2008 12:25 am
@Aristoddler,
Faith unquestioned is faith without struggle and faith without struggle is the kind of faith that's most easily broken because it is that house built on a foundation of sand rather than a foundation of stone. (I think I have my parables right, lol)

P.S. The purpose of this reply, Aristoddler, is to expand upon yours.
 
Dustin phil
 
Reply Fri 21 Mar, 2008 06:50 pm
@dancinginchains,
Could we maybe define faith?
 
Aedes
 
Reply Fri 21 Mar, 2008 08:52 pm
@Dustin phil,
Dustin wrote:
Could we maybe define faith?
Don't you think that faith by any reasonable definition could be appropriate for that statement? I do. If faith is used to mean religious affiliation, belief, or practice, then it holds true that it can be strong only if questioned. If faith is used to mean, simply, belief held without evidence, it too will be strongest only when questioned.

Sometimes, however, faith is useful and should not be questioned. I diagnosed a woman with metastatic lung cancer recently. This is a terminal diagnosis. But for her to even go on at all, and for her family to go on at all, means that they need to have faith that there is something to live for even if you know you're going to die, and they need to have faith that we in medicine can offer something to people even when we can't save their life. What's the use of questioning that kind of faith, if that's the only thing that gets someone to just get out of bed every morning and live?

But this faith is fragile and easily broken. Then again, I always maintain that deep down we are NOT fundamentally rational creatures. And perhaps there's no better evidence than when you see someone under great stress -- it's not reason that's left over when all else falls apart -- faith and its close cousin hope last a lot longer than reason. Perhaps reason is even more fragile...
 
dancinginchains
 
Reply Sat 22 Mar, 2008 01:14 pm
@Dustin phil,
Dustin wrote:
Could we maybe define faith?


"Faith is precisely the contradiction between the infinite passion of the individual's inwardness and the objective uncertainty."

Kierkegaard
 
Didymos Thomas
 
Reply Sat 22 Mar, 2008 03:21 pm
@Israelite007,
Faith without understanding is arbitrary. What's more, faith without understanding tends to be more dangerous than helpful to anyone.
 
dancinginchains
 
Reply Sat 22 Mar, 2008 05:08 pm
@Didymos Thomas,
Didymos Thomas wrote:
Faith without understanding is arbitrary. What's more, faith without understanding tends to be more dangerous than helpful to anyone.


To some degree all faith is without understanding, therefore according to your logic all faith is arbitrary - personally I disagree with that. If we understood everything about that which we believe, what purpose would faith serve? None whatsoever.

Faith is subjective; the only person it's meant to be helpful for is the individual who believes. I don't see the point of complaining how it isn't helpful to anyone, when truly by nature faith isn't meant to be helpful to anyone other than the individual.
 
Dustin phil
 
Reply Sat 22 Mar, 2008 05:20 pm
@dancinginchains,
According to the Bible, faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
 
dancinginchains
 
Reply Sat 22 Mar, 2008 05:34 pm
@Israelite007,
While I most honestly respect the great point you've made with that Dustin, I want to caution you with quoting the Bible because much of it was not written to be taken literally.
 
 

 
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