without us , Humans , does the Universe exist ?

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north
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 03:41 pm
some propose that we bring the Universe into existence , rather than the Universe was here first

how is this possible ?
 
Wisdom Seeker
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 04:18 pm
@north,
north;155308 wrote:
some propose that we bring the Universe into existence , rather than the Universe was here first

how is this possible ?


i think not, but the universe is non-sense if there are no one to rule or use it and only humans can do it. i believe the universe is an unused tool that finds her user and that is the humans.
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 04:22 pm
@Wisdom Seeker,
Perhaps the universe is ALL ours?
 
mister kitten
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 04:39 pm
@north,
north;155308 wrote:
some propose that we bring the Universe into existence , rather than the Universe was here first

how is this possible ?

If we bring the universe into existence are we not then the creators of the universe?

What if the universe is mine alone? I'm God?

Wisdom Seeker;155323 wrote:
i think not, but the universe is non-sense if there are no one to rule or use it and only humans can do it. i believe the universe is an unused tool that finds her user and that is the humans.

And what does that tool do? Without a wielder, humans?, the tool does not exist?

sometime sun;155325 wrote:
Perhaps the universe is ALL ours?

Perhaps all ours is the universe?
 
north
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 04:40 pm
@Wisdom Seeker,
Wisdom Seeker;155323 wrote:
i think not, but the universe is non-sense if there are no one to rule or use it and only humans can do it.


what of the conditions within the Universe BEFORE we Humans existed though ?



Quote:
i believe the universe is an unused tool that finds her user and that is the humans.


but what came first , the tool or Humans ?
 
Wisdom Seeker
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 05:05 pm
@north,
north;155338 wrote:
what of the conditions within the Universe BEFORE we Humans existed though ?

the building of the tool, the universe, prepared for humans
north;155338 wrote:

but what came first , the tool or Humans ?

the tool and was prepared after the coming of the humans
mister kitten;155338 wrote:
And what does that tool do? Without a wielder, humans?, the tool does not exist?

what does that tool do?
- to protect its user and to protect the tool
Without a wielder, humans?, the tool does not exist?
- since no one cares for it, it will begin to decay, it is the destruction of the tool, the end of the universe.
 
north
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 05:14 pm
@Wisdom Seeker,
Quote:
Originally Posted by north http://www.philosophyforum.com/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
what of the conditions within the Universe BEFORE we Humans existed though ?

Quote:

the building of the tool, the universe, prepared for humans


ah , I see , so a form of god comes into this then

---------- Post added 04-22-2010 at 07:16 PM ----------

Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by north http://www.philosophyforum.com/images/PHBlue/buttons/viewpost.gif
but what came first , the tool or Humans ?

the tool and was prepared after the coming of the humans

how so ?
 
Wisdom Seeker
 
Reply Thu 22 Apr, 2010 05:29 pm
@north,
north;155356 wrote:
Quote:
how so ?


i believe it was crafted by some kind of supernatural being for some kind of goal that humans were assign to attain it and that goal remains unknown to me.

i believe that the reality we live in is just a test, a test if we can be a successor to a supernatural being(s).
 
Owen phil
 
Reply Fri 23 Apr, 2010 02:28 am
@north,
north;155308 wrote:
some propose that we bring the Universe into existence , rather than the Universe was here first

how is this possible ?


It is not possible.
Clearly, the brain is necessary and prior to the existence of mind.
The universe's prior existence is required in order to produce brain.

That the universe had properties before the advent of humans, is necessarily true.

Without humans, abstract entities do not exist.
Truth, language, logic, number, etc. exist only within mind.

Our awareness is not a condition on the world at all.
 
Marat phil
 
Reply Fri 23 Apr, 2010 04:18 am
@north,
Man - is biologic Von Neumann machine. God created the first man. But modern people - is not God's dolls.
 
jgweed
 
Reply Fri 23 Apr, 2010 06:10 am
@north,
We can think of the universe as a mental concept of all that there is, but as an abstract concept with temporal existence (and a past) and operating under physical laws, it is dependent on human existence. Its significance and its meaning (including the identification of events or occasions) seems completely dependent upon humans to provide it.
 
north
 
Reply Fri 23 Apr, 2010 03:34 pm
@jgweed,
jgweed;155600 wrote:
We can think of the universe as a mental concept of all that there is,


inorder to do so means that you understand all it takes , to produce the physical objects

so please explain everything in this Universe to the last detail


Quote:
but as an abstract concept with temporal existence (and a past) and operating under physical laws, it is dependent on human existence. Its significance and its meaning (including the identification of events or occasions) seems completely dependent upon humans to provide it.


so then provide it

it should be a very long response
 
HexHammer
 
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2010 12:20 pm
@north,
north;155308 wrote:
some propose that we bring the Universe into existence , rather than the Universe was here first

how is this possible ?
It's possible because they'r skitzophrenic and imagine things.

..and you making a case of it ..uhmmmm ..yearh?
 
TuringEquivalent
 
Reply Thu 29 Apr, 2010 05:21 pm
@jgweed,
jgweed;155600 wrote:
We can think of the universe as a mental concept of all that there is, but as an abstract concept with temporal existence (and a past) and operating under physical laws, it is dependent on human existence. Its significance and its meaning (including the identification of events or occasions) seems completely dependent upon humans to provide it.



But this cannot be right, for if the universe depend on us, then if we don` t exist, then the universe would not exist. This is contrary to intuition.
 
 

 
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