Albert Camus' paradox.

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Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 05:27 pm
"You will never be happy if you continue to search for what happiness consists of. You will never live if you are looking for the meaning of life."

Does anyone find this quote to be true? Just opinion.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 05:38 pm
@Quinn phil,
Quinn;141090 wrote:
"You will never be happy if you continue to search for what happiness consists of. You will never live if you are looking for the meaning of life."

Does anyone find this quote to be true? Just opinion.


Aristotle said something akin to that some time before Camus.More than 2,000 years before. It would certainly be just opinion if no reason were given for it. Even if it is true. Opinions can be true, but they are just opinions because they are unsupported by any reasons. When they are supported by reasons they cease to be just opinions.

Aristotle supported his view on the ground that it is an entire life that is happy, not some particular moment. And that happiness is a long term process that can be achieved only by living a good and a happy life. And this is not something that can be intentionally sought, but only lived. "Call no man happy until he is dead", Aristotle said, because we will never be able to tell whether a person has been happy until his life is over. It is only then that we can make a rational assessment of the person's life.
 
Jebediah
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 05:40 pm
@Quinn phil,
I disagree. Certain things tend to make people happy; certain things tend to make people unhappy. If you figure out what these are and take the appropriate action, you will be happier.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 05:49 pm
@Jebediah,
Jebediah;141094 wrote:
I disagree. Certain things tend to make people happy; certain things tend to make people unhappy. If you figure out what these are and take the appropriate action, you will be happier.


Sure. There are temporary pleasures in life, just as there are sure to be temporary pains and sorrows. The pleasures can be sought, and we can try to avoid the sorrows. Aristotle (obviously) cannot deny that. But he was talking not about pleasures and sorrows, but about a happy life. Long term happiness. And this is what he said cannot be sought as such. We can only try to live our lives as best we can, and trust it will work out in the end. But, Aristotle pointed out that at any time disaster may strike, and what would have been judged a happy life would turn out to be an unhappy one. The life of Bernard Maidoff springs to mind here. He had much pleasure in life (from all reports). But can we say of him that he lived a happy life? Can we say of him, now that he will be in prison for the rest of his life, that he was a happy man?
 
Quinn phil
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 08:01 pm
@Jebediah,
Jebediah;141094 wrote:
I disagree. Certain things tend to make people happy; certain things tend to make people unhappy. If you figure out what these are and take the appropriate action, you will be happier.


Is a long pursuit of happiness worth the outcome? In your eyes?
 
ughaibu
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 08:12 pm
@Quinn phil,
Quinn;141140 wrote:
Is a long pursuit of happiness worth the outcome?
A long pursuit isn't necessary, smiling makes people happy, and smiling can be done almost immediately in most of our circumstances.
 
Quinn phil
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 08:25 pm
@ughaibu,
ughaibu;141144 wrote:
A long pursuit isn't necessary, smiling makes people happy, and smiling can be done almost immediately in most of our circumstances.


The simplest of solutions, and I never even thought about it! Thanks. Often smiles are fake, but I smiled right now, and it made me feel a lot better. Smile
 
north
 
Reply Thu 18 Mar, 2010 08:30 pm
@Quinn phil,
Quinn;141090 wrote:
"You will never be happy if you continue to search for what happiness consists of.


or understand the self , really

it is understanding of the self which brings happyness


Quote:
You will never live if you are looking for the meaning of life."


the meaning of life is personal thing and as well the survival of Humanity it's self
 
Jebediah
 
Reply Sat 20 Mar, 2010 12:31 pm
@Quinn phil,
kennethamy;141096 wrote:
Sure. There are temporary pleasures in life, just as there are sure to be temporary pains and sorrows. The pleasures can be sought, and we can try to avoid the sorrows. Aristotle (obviously) cannot deny that. But he was talking not about pleasures and sorrows, but about a happy life. Long term happiness. And this is what he said cannot be sought as such. We can only try to live our lives as best we can, and trust it will work out in the end. But, Aristotle pointed out that at any time disaster may strike, and what would have been judged a happy life would turn out to be an unhappy one. The life of Bernard Maidoff springs to mind here. He had much pleasure in life (from all reports). But can we say of him that he lived a happy life? Can we say of him, now that he will be in prison for the rest of his life, that he was a happy man?


I was disagree with Camus. I am talking about long term happiness as well. Aristotle has a good point.

Quinn;141140 wrote:
Is a long pursuit of happiness worth the outcome? In your eyes?


Yes. But you can certainly figure out what brings happiness in the long term, can't you? Things like your general attitude towards life, being in a happy relationship, having a job you like. Not just short term pleasures.

*********

I actually misread the Camus quote Surprised

I disagree with the idea that you shouldn't search for what happiness consists of, but what he's talking about continuing to search for what happiness consists of.
 
HexHammer
 
Reply Sat 20 Mar, 2010 01:32 pm
@Quinn phil,
Quinn;141090 wrote:
"You will never be happy if you continue to search for what happiness consists of. You will never live if you are looking for the meaning of life."

Does anyone find this quote to be true? Just opinion.
Wouldn't agree with it fully, only partially.

Some has too high expectations of life, wants the perfect life, perfect gf/bf, friends, car, cloth, job, ...everything! This is why you can se so many miserable ritch people, and so many happy 3rd world country poor people, who smiles and are cheerful.

Many reach their goals, because they don't have high expectations, and therefore are content.

..if your expectations fails ..you will be sad and live in sorrow..
 
Reconstructo
 
Reply Sat 20 Mar, 2010 01:53 pm
@Quinn phil,
Quinn;141090 wrote:
"You will never be happy if you continue to search for what happiness consists of. You will never live if you are looking for the meaning of life."

Does anyone find this quote to be true? Just opinion.


I can see what he means, but I don't agree, as much as I love Camus. Did you know he was a sort of suicide? Or so Will Styron argues in Darkness Visible, a book about depression? Camus took a ride with a well-known speed demon....

Have you read the The Fall? I think Camus was a gloomy if brilliant man.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Sat 20 Mar, 2010 03:41 pm
@ughaibu,
ughaibu;141144 wrote:
A long pursuit isn't necessary, smiling makes people happy, and smiling can be done almost immediately in most of our circumstances.


Smiling may certainly give pleasure, but pleasure and happiness are not quite the same thing.

---------- Post added 03-20-2010 at 05:44 PM ----------

Reconstructo;141651 wrote:
I can see what he means, but I don't agree, as much as I love Camus. Did you know he was a sort of suicide? Or so Will Styron argues in Darkness Visible, a book about depression? Camus took a ride with a well-known speed demon....

Have you read the The Fall? I think Camus was a gloomy if brilliant man.


What is a "sort of suicide"? It seems to me that either you are a suicide or not. A "sort of suicide" is like, "sort of pregnant".

But what has this biographical fact (whatever it is) to do with the truth or falsity of what Camus said.
 
Quinn phil
 
Reply Thu 25 Mar, 2010 11:02 pm
@kennethamy,
kennethamy;141691 wrote:
Smiling may certainly give pleasure, but pleasure and happiness are not quite the same thing.


Agreed.


kennethamy;141691 wrote:

What is a "sort of suicide"? It seems to me that either you are a suicide or not. A "sort of suicide" is like, "sort of pregnant".

But what has this biographical fact (whatever it is) to do with the truth or falsity of what Camus said.


Well, a suicide would seemingly have a much different view on the pursuit of happiness than someone like me, who is not a suicide. Are you a suicide?
 
 

 
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