@Yogi DMT,
Yogi DMT wrote:You are not required to save anybody. If i didn't save someone i would not be directly nor indirectly killing them. I'm just saying that by saving 5 people that didn't have to be saved from the start, that is the best possibility considering it's either save 5 or 1. Five people or one person dies, its a two sided question, one side has a far better outcome, i'll take it. Yes there would be an innocent life lost but not at my hands only at the hands of those who put that person(s) in this scenario to begin with. And neither am i one to put a value on a life.
It is true that you are not morally responsible or to blame for the incident, but that's not the point I'm making. You feel obligated to save an innocent person's life if you can, and especially if it doesn't threaten your own life. The track scenario is a dilemma because it involves killing one person to save five. The track scenario goes like this:
Five people are tied up to on one side of a train track, and one person is tied up on the other side. A train is coming and it is heading for the track with the five people. If you do nothing and allow the train to go on its original course, it will hit the five people and the one person will stay alive. However, you can pull a lever that will shift the train's path so that it hits the one person instead. If you pull the lever you are causing the death of that innocent person, and that person wasn't going to be killed until you got involved and
pulled the lever. Pulling the lever is an action that causes a death that wouldn't have occurred otherwise. You have killed that person to save five. Do you understand?
---------- Post added at 11:48 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:34 AM ----------
Ultracrepidarian wrote:Yeah, no blood will be on my hands. This is so absurd, but imagine that the one person is a 1yr old infant and has an identical twin on side B, plus 4 other people. The fact that the lever is "naturally" in the "B position" - meaning the train goes to side B - doesn't mean anything to me, because the position of the lever is not natural at all. That is what I understand from the thought experiment. We cannot conceive of a reason why the lever should be set for A or B. All other things being equal, would we rather see 5 people die or 1? I value each individual's life and five heads are better than one.
It is more interesting to imagine two elderly souls on side B and one teenager on side A. Soon, you have to make some sort of formula to handle all possible situations with age differences. Then throw in gender. And how nice of people they are?
But who cares? Emergency rescue professionals, soldiers, and officers in war. That formula will not be applicable to non-emergency situations and morality should be concerned with life qua life - not life qua emergency situation. That is my assertion. Please disagree if you like.
I think I agree with you. Gender shouldn't matter at all, but whether or not you know the people are innocent is a whole different deal. For example, if Hitler was the one person, I would kill him. Why? Because Hitler is not relevantly similar to the innocent people on the other side of the track. He is a mass murdering, sociopathic dictator that wants to dominate the world. If expert emergency people were involved they would try and save all of them assuming they were innocent people, and they would try until the train hits. I've heard enough scenarios where I know they wouldn't have killed the one person by pulling the lever.
This should throw you for a loop. What if the five people on the track are all bad people, and by bad people I mean people who intentionally cause the pain and suffering of other people? What if you didn't know this and you saved them instead of saving the one person who was kind and decent? That one person would cause more happiness and the five people would cause nothing but suffering, but you didn't know that when you pulled the lever. You see the problem with utilitarianism?