Probably there is something your grandparents could describe in the same way, that you just buy in the store. But you have a choice between buying it conveniently, and making it the old way. Best of both.

Probably there is something your grandparents could describe in the same way, that you just buy in the store. But you have a choice between buying it conveniently, and making it the old way. Best of both.

And, anyway, I don't remember homemade ice-cream being better than store-bought. On the contrary. But, of course, that is why I am never impressed when a restaurant is praised for serving home-made food. I know some homes....well, never mind.

Yes, the choice is our own, to make or not to make.
Is convenience robbing us of our responsibility?
Does it really matter that my children don't have that memory,or have I allowed convenience to cause me to fail in my responsibility?

---------- Post added 05-18-2010 at 12:46 AM ----------



I don't think it mattered which was really better, that is relative to the experience anyway. I remember pbj sandwiches tasting like heaven on the last day of a canoe trip, when food supplies were low.

Does every new technology cost us something equally valuable?

What a good story - thanks.



Yes it does. Every change to the way we live our lives - large and small - has its repercussions. Some are dire while others barely warrant mention. But I believe humanity has a bad, bad habit of not seeing the whole picture when it comes to making changes towards convenience. To the extent that this is true, it speaks towards what has been both a boon and a bane: The draw we feel towards achieving immediate goals.

I used to grind ice cream too; in my case, at my grandmother's house. We did it on hot, muggy afternoons and I swear I always got the longest shift and the sorest arms. Like was already mentioned, this never tasted as good to the tongue as the stuff one can buy in the store that takes no immediate effort, is relatively cheap and convenient. But the whole experience was much more satisfying on grandma's porch. This isn't whimsical melancholy, there's a solid basis for this.

In our minds (and in this case) we want "Ice Cream". Logical suggests that - as Jeb pointed out - one can choose which he or she wants. But we are creatures of expedience, and when our apparent goal is "Ice Cream", why would anyone choose an inferior product brought at great effort?

We lose something vital in our humanity when these goals become so easy that they require no investment of our time and energies. Through this, we value them less, work less, exercise our bodies less and get fatter through the good stuff because they're so accessible. Now, I'll be the first one to tell you that I *love* ice cream and I buy mine at the store - but truth be told, almost anyone would. The payoff -vs- the goal we're seeking is almost absurd in its disparity. The point: Its too alluring and too seductive to go the easy way.

Take cars: Who'd deny that the freedom, independence and benefits they provide is simply fantastic? Yet, did we stop to think about the fatalities, impaired driving hazard, pollution (and its resultant oil glut and the conflicts/fatalities that causes), decreased exercise or community impact, urban sprawl or any of the other thousand diminutive factors that came with it? And yes, I too have a car despite how I feel; the reason: Its too alluring not to have one.

I don't demonize all technology, but I think it wise that - as philosophers - we look at the whole picture; what's lost as well as what's gained. And this I'll say with complete confidence: When our lives become a litany of conveniences had with little to no effort, the meaning and satisfaction of those lives is diminished since the immediate/obvious goal becomes void of individual investment.

Good point - thanks

As a fisherman, I practice this regularly. There are many easier, and more productive, ways to catch a Trout than with a fly rod. Any fly fisherman will tell you that isn't the point. I like to fish rivers, on foot, precisely because it is difficult.

Another great example. I believe in this subject lies a truth that is, by the day, becoming more important as humans continue to seek 'happiness' while simultaneously grabbing onto conveniences that ultimately make them quite the opposite. I believe that general feelings of well being, in our species, arise only when we do work and toil and then feel the thinnest slice of goal-gratification. But when we skip over the 'toil' in lieu of instant (or non-'earned') gratification, we lose the inner satisfaction that is hard to foresee.

I would not have more feelings of well being if I walked to the grocery store and back than if I drove.

Why should we feel better for having worked at something?

Wouldn't it be better to work at things which require work, and take the quick method when that works well?

Hey Jeb,

I think you would, quite a bit. It's not an immediate, high-impact feeling of euphoria, but forgetting for a moment that the goal is "food", you'd exercise yourself, perhaps talk to folks, see what's going on, get some time to think, enjoy just being outside and much, much more. Then, when you got your food, the whole process would feel just a wee bit more satisfying in an overall fashion having gotten out of your house and into the fresh air with a slightly more lively body and an overall experience that says "Living" rather than just "Hurry up and Get".

But... even though I really believe this, I'm not sure it much matters. Take me, for example, my wife and I purposefully go out walking each day, but I'm hypocritical in that I drive to the store. The reason: Its simply too convenient.. and we're back to the main point.

I'm not sure there's a "should" here. I believe that inner feeling of accomplishment adds to the satisfaction of overall meeting that goal. When we see just the goal, only the goal and no correlary benefits or drawbacks, then the expedient becomes our only focus and on go the horse blinders to other aspects.

Absolutely. Unfortunately, no human (in our society with the means) can make that decision consistently and wisely without being overwhelmed with the extreme practicality of simply "getting" what we think we need or want. Its simply too alluring; making far too much sense to our goal-oriented natures to not do it the easy way.

Thanks for asking, I hope this helps understanding.

But I picked that example for a reason. One year in college I walked to the grocery store for food because I didn't have a car. Not more than I mile I think, but it was not more satisfying than driving. In particular I found that carrying the bags made my upper back sore by the time I was home. And that makes a contrast with exercising deliberately--where the soreness is satisfying, because it seems to me that I am working at something worthwhile. Walking to get groceries does not seem to me to be worthwhile. If it did seem that way to someone, they would probably find it satisfying.

I'm supposing that there isn't an inherent inner feeling of accomplishment, that's when it becomes a question of "should".

I think we can learn which things require work--the alternative of just working hard on the assumption that it's better doesn't seem very good.

Coke-flavored home-made ice cream.

Try this out Lily and let me know how it turns out.

Hola,

I understand, and I think those are valid concerns. But I fear the perspective of what I'm trying communicate isn't coming through. Of course it doesn't seem worthwhile to you (or to me, since it appears we're in similiar situations) because we've grown up in a setting where such isn't necessary. All the benefits I spoke about earlier aren't even on our radars - it just doesn't seem worth it. But, as I mentioned, the point of the exercise (to me) is to recognize the loss as well as the gain in this environment.

No, I'm not saying that you consciously enjoyed it in the setting it took place, but that's only because you carry the conscious knowledge that you don't have to work for it - and its hard to deny that there is loss on many levels. In any case, as I said earlier, this is an egg we can't unscramble.

As I sat, last evening, eating a bowl of store bought vanilla ice cream with herschey's syrup, I was reminded of the ice cream we children made in the garage, with my father, on summer evenings of my youth.

Herschey's syrup came in a can then, not a plastic bottle, and we had a nut grinder filled with walnuts.
We always had an old handcranked freezer, that we children took turns cranking until the ice cream was stiff.
My father eschewed the new electric freezers, he said it spoiled the whole experience.

Are there any of us left out there?
Will the next generation live their entire lives without tasting ice cream hand cranked in their own driveway?

Does every new technology cost us something equally valuable?

Are we doomed to spend our lives eating store bought ice cream? Ugh!

I wonder if the antique shop has an old hand crank freezer I can buy?