Meta-Metaphysics

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Reply Thu 25 Mar, 2010 06:36 pm
Since metaphysics deal with the probable, I'm curious to know if someone could say believing in alien life is metaphysical, along with the concepts of films like Star Trek and Star Wars. EX: Can there be a Millennium Falcon flying out there now? Will we be able to go to 'Warp Speed?' These are possibilities that we can consider but have vague to no idea how it's to be done.
Further, scientists claim for a fact that Black Hole exist when no one has been up next to one. Can we say that is a metaphysical concept?
 
Humanity
 
Reply Thu 25 Mar, 2010 08:02 pm
@Strodgers,
Strodgers;143781 wrote:
Since metaphysics deal with the probable, I'm curious to know if someone could say believing in alien life is metaphysical, along with the concepts of films like Star Trek and Star Wars. EX: Can there be a Millennium Falcon flying out there now? Will we be able to go to 'Warp Speed?' These are possibilities that we can consider but have vague to no idea how it's to be done.
Further, scientists claim for a fact that Black Hole exist when no one has been up next to one. Can we say that is a metaphysical concept?
If you interpret the above literally, yes, they can be termed as meta-physical.

However, in the current situation, there are consensus as to what is specifically to be defined as 'metaphysics', 'science' and 'science-fiction'.
There is unlikely to be disagreement to these terms.

Metaphysics is a philosophical subject that deal with the non-empirical issues of being beyond the physical.

Science is solely empirical in dealing with the physical and nonphysical.
There are many scientific hypothesis floating around, but they are all expected to be concluded (if any) purely based on direct or indirect (e.g. quarks) observations based on the scientific method and peer review.

Science fiction is another type of fiction.

The above is all about 'language games' and the terms and meaning' are changeable depending on majority consensus.
After 10,000 years in the future , many of the meanings of the words we use today could be changed by then.
 
Strodgers
 
Reply Tue 30 Mar, 2010 08:33 pm
@Humanity,
Humanity;143807 wrote:
If you interpret the above literally, yes, they can be termed as meta-physical.

However, in the current situation, there are consensus as to what is specifically to be defined as 'metaphysics', 'science' and 'science-fiction'.
There is unlikely to be disagreement to these terms.

Metaphysics is a philosophical subject that deal with the non-empirical issues of being beyond the physical.

Science is solely empirical in dealing with the physical and nonphysical.
There are many scientific hypothesis floating around, but they are all expected to be concluded (if any) purely based on direct or indirect (e.g. quarks) observations based on the scientific method and peer review.

Science fiction is another type of fiction.

The above is all about 'language games' and the terms and meaning' are changeable depending on majority consensus.
After 10,000 years in the future , many of the meanings of the words we use today could be changed by then.


What is Empirical? Physicists use mathematics to predict things like black holes. Mathematics is nothing more than a metaphysical concept. Show me a real '2', or 'two' or 'TWO'. In binary it's '10'. Or one zero. There are many ways of showing the number, but what is a real 2?
Mathematics may indeed be universal, but the understanding of it is quite local. Meaning, Earth Mathematicians are like Elementary school intellects compared to a being 10,000 Light Years away, which could be in comparison to a University student. His/Her/Its mathematics may say Einstein is wrong. I watch the Science Channel often, and they have yet show anything that an every day person would call empirical. I have yet to see one of these people, including Stephen Hawking, who does not sound like some Metaphysician.

The Matrix is a good Metaphysical movie (a lousy film though in my opinion), it's also science fiction.
 
Strodgers
 
Reply Sun 25 Apr, 2010 04:33 pm
@Strodgers,
So I understand what I did wrong, could someone explain why this was move from Metaphysics to here? Thank you.
 
VideCorSpoon
 
Reply Mon 26 Apr, 2010 01:18 pm
@Strodgers,
Strodgers;143781 wrote:
Since metaphysics deal with the probable, I'm curious to know if someone could say believing in alien life is metaphysical, along with the concepts of films like Star Trek and Star Wars. EX: Can there be a Millennium Falcon flying out there now? Will we be able to go to 'Warp Speed?' These are possibilities that we can consider but have vague to no idea how it's to be done.
Further, scientists claim for a fact that Black Hole exist when no one has been up next to one. Can we say that is a metaphysical concept?


I would first assume that before dealing with the sole probability (metaphysics-->ontology-->categories--> predication-->philosophy of language-->logic, etc.), metaphysics would deal first with the predicates of ultimate reality, what really exists, and what distinguishes it from one another and makes it possible.

With all this in mind, I would suppose that alien life could be considered metaphysical if you think about the issue in a few ways. The first would be the most obvious application of metaphysical ontology, being that there are specific predicates that are (for lack of a better word) universal in substantive predication. For example, we could have humans on one planet and aliens on another, but the probabilistic variables are innumerable. However, the substantive predicates could work out to where whatever the appearance of an alien or a human, all attributes (however complex or simple they may be) are predicated on a common substrate (humanoid form, atomic composition, corporeal form, etc.). It really is a never ending story as far as that is concerned.

But then if you look at it from a physicalist point of view though, that only physical are fundamental, any state (alien, humanoid, etc.) whether it be featuring an underlying property (maybe some base element for example), or relationary particulars, they all constitute a fundamental physical metaphysical basis.

And I bring up ontology in particular not because it is something out of the blue, but because it is categorical precursor for logical deductive/inductive reasoning (ie. Logic). It is within that field that you may get a better answer as far as probability calculus is concerned. Whether or not something may exist or even if it will be possible to, say, travel at warp speed, depend on a myriad of variables dependant of all things on our own truth functional framework. Occasionally that framework is overturned. Such is the case with black holes, where our preconceived framwwork must be considered, overturned, and revised.

On this note, there was an interesting finding that black holes may contain other universes. True story (possibly?). LOL! Check out the link;

Every Black Hole Contains Another Universe?
 
 

 
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