Greater logic?

  1. Philosophy Forum
  2. » General Discussion
  3. » Greater logic?

Get Email Updates Email this Topic Print this Page

Reply Thu 25 Feb, 2010 05:26 pm
Long have I ponderd about logic, most of what has been avaliable was only what I call "liniar logic" which I define as clearly defined prerimiters, clearly defined frame of scenario, objective and purpose ..etc.

People with high IQ would be able to solve highly complex liniar logically matters, but ..when matter, purpose and objective ..etc, becomes unclear people with high IQ often fail, because they need to have defined perimiters and such, that's where RQ comes to play.

I was inspired to ponder about this by reading this article: Clever fools: Why a high IQ doesn't mean you're smart - life - 02 November 2009 - New Scientist

I have a brilliant doctor friend, who uncritically told me a story he heard in a auditorium filled with fellow doctors at Panum (danish educational institute ..or something)

This story he told me I will propose as a challenge to this forum. [disclaimer] english isn't my first language, so there can be mistranslations, sorry!

[QUOTE]
2 garbage men, who had been in the buisness for 2 decades, who had sufferd foul odeurs through out their career, took on a vacation to Turkey and went to the perfume streets.
As they walked the one would become ill, and in the end fell to the ground. The helpful perfume sellers would aid the poor man with their smelling salts, but only making him go to a deeper coma.
The other garbage man would realize it was the thick odour in the street that caused the problem, and pulled his friend out to cleaner air, which helped and he would awaken from the coma.

Conclusion: each their scent.
[/QUOTE]
 
pantheras
 
Reply Sat 27 Feb, 2010 10:27 am
@HexHammer,
High IQ defines only how fast and how precisely you are able to react on the impressions which have any defined solution. The way you get that ability can be get by the different ways of thinking not because these ways have something in common, but it is simply just because once you are able to deduce something, this ability can be applied into something similar.

The key to be able think logically isnt in learning and understanding certain things, it is in learning and understanding things which are completely different.

There is no such a thing as a great logic, because it is not about ability to understand things in one certain way, it is about capability of understanding things by many different ways and wider radius you have, more certain your conclusions can be.
 
Fido
 
Reply Sat 27 Feb, 2010 11:01 am
@HexHammer,
HexHammer;132539 wrote:
Long have I ponderd about logic, most of what has been avaliable was only what I call "liniar logic" which I define as clearly defined prerimiters, clearly defined frame of scenario, objective and purpose ..etc.

People with high IQ would be able to solve highly complex liniar logically matters, but ..when matter, purpose and objective ..etc, becomes unclear people with high IQ often fail, because they need to have defined perimiters and such, that's where RQ comes to play.

I was inspired to ponder about this by reading this article: Clever fools: Why a high IQ doesn't mean you're smart - life - 02 November 2009 - New Scientist

I have a brilliant doctor friend, who uncritically told me a story he heard in a auditorium filled with fellow doctors at Panum (danish educational institute ..or something)

This story he told me I will propose as a challenge to this forum. [disclaimer] english isn't my first language, so there can be mistranslations, sorry!


When I was younger I used to do a lot of work around sewage treatment plants... After a while, the crap started to smell like money, but then, the money began to smell like crap..

What constitutes high IQ is not so easily defined... I have known some very intelligent individuals without so much as a high school degree who did very well in life...I have done pretty well on a year at college, and to do more would be an impediment to my education...I think anyone might agree that the intelligent have certain characteristics in common, and I might begin the list with a sense, of the future, and what it takes to achieve ones goals in time...There is a certain attitude that helps my intelligence work for me, and it is dogged... I don't give up when presented with a problem so what I consider impossible is often far beyond what another might consider impossible...I listen to music, but I do not consider my head for that purpose, nor to keep my ears apart... I relish the opportunity to solve problems, perhaps because my own often seem beyond solution, but even there, I do not give up...
 
HexHammer
 
Reply Sat 27 Feb, 2010 12:28 pm
@pantheras,
pantheras;133228 wrote:

There is no such a thing as a great logic, because it is not about ability to understand things in one certain way, it is about capability of understanding things by many different ways and wider radius you have, more certain your conclusions can be.
My claim is, that there is such thing. People filled with testosterone will often not display a greater feat of greater logic.

..and please solve my story puzzel! :poke-eye: Very Happy
 
pantheras
 
Reply Sat 27 Feb, 2010 03:41 pm
@HexHammer,
I dont think that I understand what is your story about, what it is trying to say. Perhaps it is because Im not so good in these conceptional puzzles.

Testosterone is the accelerator which can easily lead subject to focus on error things. However it changes perception in the way that there is any focus possible. It is about giving importance to various things, so this importance will drive automaticly your sense to make any decision. Without testosterone you are driven just by the importance you learned from the other subjects.
 
HexHammer
 
Reply Sat 27 Feb, 2010 03:57 pm
@pantheras,
pantheras;133337 wrote:
I dont think that I understand what is your story about, what it is trying to say. Perhaps it is because Im not so good in these conceptional puzzles.
Trust me on this, just discussing it is giving a clue away.
 
pantheras
 
Reply Sat 27 Feb, 2010 04:08 pm
@HexHammer,
Possibly it means that someone who is used to various smells, can get ill by other smell. It doesnt make any sense.
 
Wisdom Seeker
 
Reply Sat 17 Apr, 2010 01:07 pm
@HexHammer,
HexHammer;132539 wrote:
2 garbage men, who had been in the buisness for 2 decades, who had sufferd foul odeurs through out their career, took on a vacation to Turkey and went to the perfume streets.
As they walked the one would become ill, and in the end fell to the ground. The helpful perfume sellers would aid the poor man with their smelling salts, but only making him go to a deeper coma.
The other garbage man would realize it was the thick odour in the street that caused the problem, and pulled his friend out to cleaner air, which helped and he would awaken from the coma.


just like fire cannot live with ice
and ice cannot live with fire
they are just weakening each other
because they are opposite to each other
but if fire live with his fellow fire
and ice live with his fellow ice
they both become stronger
because they are the same

Opposite is your weakness
Sameness is your advantage
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sat 17 Apr, 2010 04:58 pm
@Wisdom Seeker,
Logic kills.......
 
Reconstructo
 
Reply Sat 17 Apr, 2010 07:52 pm
@sometime sun,
sometime sun;153299 wrote:
Logic kills.......

Ah, but "logic" is used in so many different ways. For me, the real logic is the transcendental logic. We formalize that to the best of our ability just as we might calculate the digits of pi.
 
sometime sun
 
Reply Sat 17 Apr, 2010 07:58 pm
@Reconstructo,
Reconstructo;153347 wrote:
Ah, but "logic" is used in so many different ways. For me, the real logic is the transcendental logic. We formalize that to the best of our ability just as we might calculate the digits of pi.

Matheminia kills language, but sings its own song and composses its own clarity.
I may be coming to you with advice on getting into mathematics soon?
I love algebra, love it.
 
Reconstructo
 
Reply Sat 17 Apr, 2010 08:05 pm
@sometime sun,
sometime sun;153350 wrote:
Matheminia kills language, but sings its own song and composses its own clarity.
I may be coming to you with advice on getting into mathematics soon?
I love algebra, love it.


I see mathematics as a white-washed logos. I sincerely believe that mathema and logos share the same core. One might call it a proto-logic. Consider the words "not" and "what." Right there we have negation and x. (Variables.) Consider an abstract singular word like "being." It conceptually the same as one, I think. Of course I go on forever about math just now. Nothing is more beautiful, except perhaps the one type of philosophy that overlaps with it...the transcendental. Algebra is sweet. The manipulation of symbols. Behind all the various ways to express the number is the raw concept of what? Pure quantity? Pure magnitude? Think of all the number systems. Write it in trinary or hexidecimal. It's the same number. THe digits are not the essence. And this is beautiful. And also true. As it is cut from the transcendental logic, from our sense of the true and the coherent. Math is all about unification. And the number of one is the beautiful center and anchor of it all. And the center of concept too? I'm still learning, but what I've learned already blows my mind, and I will share the fun. :Glasses:
 
Fido
 
Reply Mon 19 Apr, 2010 05:32 am
@sometime sun,
sometime sun;153299 wrote:
Logic kills.......


Logic that is quite correctly applied to the finite physical reality does in fact kill infinite humanity when it is applied to us...
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Mon 19 Apr, 2010 05:57 am
@Fido,
Fido;153925 wrote:
Logic that is quite correctly applied to the finite physical reality does in fact kill infinite humanity when it is applied to us...


Maybe, but I don't know how you would know that from personal experience.
 
Fido
 
Reply Mon 19 Apr, 2010 08:19 am
@kennethamy,
kennethamy;153929 wrote:
Maybe, but I don't know how you would know that from personal experience.

I do not know that from personal experience unless one considers the experiances of others through reading and the totality of life as personal experience... A logical truth in the physical world can be used to formulate a statement of law in regard to nature, physical reality...When people form an idea of perfection in regard to human behavior, and try to mold human behavior to it through the formulation of; laws all hell breaks loose...It does not matter that they think logic supports their ideals...People live in the real world, and so must confrom at some point to nature, but they conceive of themselves as spiritual, and they ultimately resist any forms, any social forms which do not serve their survival, their relationships, and their happiness...

Before logic can be applied to people, some one should prove once and for all that people are logical, and they are not...Logic is used by people to solve their physical problems in the physical world, and other than that, they are what they are, sometimes logical from an objective perspective, and often not...The fundamental moral virtues do not survive in our thoughts because they are rationally defensible... People do not risk their lives for any reason because it is rational, though they might find some rationale for it... People know that life is all, and upon that knowledge any risk of life, or sacrifice, though moral, is irrational...
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Mon 19 Apr, 2010 08:42 am
@Fido,
Fido;153965 wrote:


Before logic can be applied to people, some one should prove once and for all that people are logical, and they are not....


But to say that people are not logical is to apply logic to people already.
 
Fido
 
Reply Mon 19 Apr, 2010 09:23 am
@kennethamy,
kennethamy;153973 wrote:
But to say that people are not logical is to apply logic to people already.


Agreed, that it is a logical judgement of the situation; but what can we logically do with it???...

One may logically draw certain conclusion as to the justice of any situation, but when those logical conclusions are used to build a social form like law, or government then one has frozen a dynnamic situation suitable for dynamic people in fluid situations, and certainly, it may work for a time as our government worked for a time, but eventually some will find their way around it, and others will be trapped in a form they cannot change to meet their needs...People build social forms out of their understanding of human behavior and human needs, and like all knowledge, the understanding grows as new facts are discovered...

If we say love is the relationship, the moral form, and that marriage is the social form built out of the ideal of love, then we can easily see the problem all laid our... People often fall back on their form when the relationship is stressed, or failing... Some times, people's conception of the social forms and the sorts of rules that entails destroys the relationship before it has had a chance to grow, and other times, if people are in love it does not matter in the least if they are married, or that they are married, because the love relationship entralls them... People build their social forms out of a logical understanding of the moral form, but people grow and change out of their forms the way a crab can outgrow his shell because they adapt to their reality as social forms cannot without great effort be made to adapt..
 
HexHammer
 
Reply Mon 19 Apr, 2010 01:46 pm
@HexHammer,
[CENTER]Work in Progress!!
[/CENTER]

Over the years, criminal investigation has found burned legs, which puzzled sience, where the rest of the body was missing. Many theorized it was some kind of spontanious selfcombustion, which burned the body, but was refuded by logic, saying human flesh consist of ~80% water, and therefore can't burn ..that's logically! Further evidence to support this claim is show at the morgue where burning corpses leaves bones, which has to be grinded, at those aforementioned crime scenes there are no bones. What further under mines any burning flesh theory, is that all the furnitures are intact, no scorching, no nothing!
 
Fido
 
Reply Mon 19 Apr, 2010 09:59 pm
@HexHammer,
HexHammer;154089 wrote:
[CENTER]Work in Progress!![/CENTER]



Over the years, criminal investigation has found burned legs, which puzzled sience, where the rest of the body was missing. Many theorized it was some kind of spontanious selfcombustion, which burned the body, but was refuded by logic, saying human flesh consist of ~80% water, and therefore can't burn ..that's logically! Further evidence to support this claim is show at the morgue where burning corpses leaves bones, which has to be grinded, at those aforementioned crime scenes there are no bones. What further under mines any burning flesh theory, is that all the furnitures are intact, no scorching, no nothing!

There is no such thing as spontanious human combustion... Virtually all the people who burned in this fashion were heavy drinkers and smokers... furnature burned with them and in one instance, the heat was so great it cooked food in a running refrigerator...Your average person may be 80% percent water, but older people ar significantly more dense, and we all have a lot of combustible body fat... A cigarette starting a bed or chair on fire is enty enough kindlling...
 
HexHammer
 
Reply Wed 5 May, 2010 04:27 am
@HexHammer,
lalalalalalalalalala
 
 

 
  1. Philosophy Forum
  2. » General Discussion
  3. » Greater logic?
Copyright © 2021 MadLab, LLC :: Terms of Service :: Privacy Policy :: Page generated in 0.03 seconds on 01/22/2021 at 05:06:50