What is the point?

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Camerama
 
Reply Sat 21 Nov, 2009 05:51 pm
@gotmilk9991,
You may mistake my "happiness" for some hedonist pleasure. It is not. Happiness is only possible through the achievement of values. A value is that which you seek to achieve or maintain. No matter your particular hierarchy of values, the principle is constant. Your happiness is unconditionally derived from the satisfaction of your values.
 
IntoTheLight
 
Reply Sat 21 Nov, 2009 06:02 pm
@Camerama,
Camerama;105001 wrote:
You may mistake my "happiness" for some hedonist pleasure. It is not. Happiness is only possible through the achievement of values. A value is that which you seek to achieve or maintain. No matter your particular hierarchy of values, the principle is constant. Your happiness is unconditionally derived from the satisfaction of your values.


I appreciate the clarification; it's a good one.

Looks pretty ironclad to me. Using those definitions, I have to concur with your premise.

--IntoTheLight--
 
longknowledge
 
Reply Wed 16 Dec, 2009 07:18 pm
@gotmilk9991,
gotmilk9991;94562 wrote:
Why do we live? Why do we decide to continue, to strive, to accomplish, and to fail. What is the point when thousands, maybe even hundreds of years from now, noone will be around to remember our accomplishments and failures, short of geographical failures. But even then, those will have no meaning and are finite. Why do we try?

To get to the Other Side!
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Wed 16 Dec, 2009 07:22 pm
@longknowledge,
longknowledge;111926 wrote:
To get to the Other Side!


And, if we do that, then what do you think we'll know?
 
Reconstructo
 
Reply Wed 16 Dec, 2009 07:29 pm
@Camerama,
Camerama;104991 wrote:
The point is happiness. Your purpose in life is the achievement of the highest form of happiness


This sounds pretty spot-on to me. Well put.
 
Deckard
 
Reply Wed 16 Dec, 2009 07:55 pm
@gotmilk9991,
gotmilk9991;94562 wrote:
Why do we live? Why do we decide to continue, to strive, to accomplish, and to fail. What is the point when thousands, maybe even hundreds of years from now, noone will be around to remember our accomplishments and failures, short of geographical failures. But even then, those will have no meaning and are finite. Why do we try?



Q: Why do we try?
A: It is more boring not to.
 
longknowledge
 
Reply Wed 16 Dec, 2009 10:13 pm
@Deckard,
Deckard;111941 wrote:
Q: Why do we try?
A: It is more boring not to.

It' s the same answer as to why we incarnate. We are all God. However, being all powerful and all knowing is all boring. So to relieve our boredom we limit ourselves by wiping out our memories and taking on a human body to see what adventures we can get involved in. And here we are, or rather


[CENTER]HERE I AM![/CENTER]

[CENTER]:flowers:[/CENTER]
 
Yogi DMT
 
Reply Wed 16 Dec, 2009 10:29 pm
@gotmilk9991,
We live to find a meaning in life, the sooner we realize that there is no meaning to life, the sooner we can just live it as happily as we can. There is no god, sorry. If you'd like to believe there is, i'm not going to stop you. Your outlook on life and is probably going to be less bleak than mine Smile.
 
Deckard
 
Reply Thu 17 Dec, 2009 06:18 am
@longknowledge,
longknowledge;111982 wrote:
It' s the same answer as to why we incarnate. We are all God. However, being all powerful and all knowing is all boring. So to relieve our boredom we limit ourselves by wiping out our memories and taking on a human body to see what adventures we can get involved in. And here we are, or rather


I think a lot of people come up with this idea all by themselves. Also the idea that God was lonely so he split himself up into separate consciousnesses. I'm not too worried about whether it makes sense. I do wonder if there are any established religions that actually espouse this sort of theology. Is there some ancient teaching of the bored and lonely God or is this a newer new age development?
 
longknowledge
 
Reply Fri 18 Dec, 2009 04:02 pm
@Deckard,
Deckard;112060 wrote:
I think a lot of people come up with this idea all by themselves. Also the idea that God was lonely so he split himself up into separate consciousnesses. I'm not too worried about whether it makes sense. I do wonder if there are any established religions that actually espouse this sort of theology. Is there some ancient teaching of the bored and lonely God or is this a newer new age development?

I came up with it on my own, but then I read it in a new age book, I forget the title. I may have also seen it in the Conversations with God materials. I'll check and let you know. As far as I know there's no established religion that espouses it.
 
Reconstructo
 
Reply Fri 18 Dec, 2009 04:20 pm
@Deckard,
Deckard;112060 wrote:
Is there some ancient teaching of the bored and lonely God or is this a newer new age development?


Alan Watts goes into something like this in "the Book." He refers to the Vedas. I haven't checked the Vedas to see if his interpretation was a stretch or not. But the idea is beautiful. That God plays a game of hide and seek with him/herself to kill eternity (rather than time).

It's a great example of philosophy/myth not relying on argument but rather on an explanation that appeals to us aesthetically/religiously. I would hate to see philosophy abandon this element. At the same time there is indeed a place for argument.
 
taboo
 
Reply Sun 27 Dec, 2009 02:35 am
@gotmilk9991,
gotmilk9991;94562 wrote:
Why do we live? Why do we decide to continue, to strive, to accomplish, and to fail. What is the point when thousands, maybe even hundreds of years from now, noone will be around to remember our accomplishments and failures, short of geographical failures. But even then, those will have no meaning and are finite. Why do we try?



Here is a practical guide I read some where

Pick something (out of the lists of things to do and that include doing nothing,finding the ultimate point, doing what you are doing in this forum,or even blowing yourself off )that interests you and keep busying yourself with it.And remember all things in the list are the same and don't mean any thing nobler than what they are.
Laughing
 
William
 
Reply Sun 27 Dec, 2009 05:05 am
@gotmilk9991,
gotmilk9991;94562 wrote:
Why do we live?


Why do you ask it? Is there something missing? What is it about YOUR
life that prompts you to ask such a question? Ahh, now I am getting personal huh? Most don't want to discuss all that has occurred in their life or what they have experienced for fear of another thinking them less.

Most don't have an opportunity to offer what they can and it is in that offering, what life is all about. Each and everyone offering something that gives them an understanding of why they are here. Without that then the reasonable question is what is my use. Damn! Surely, I am not a nothing! I am good for something!

gotmilk9991;94562 wrote:
Why do we decide to continue, to strive, to accomplish, and to fail.


Sadly, some don't! If we, in what we have to offer, NOT LEND, NOT TO WANT IT BACK, what we have so others will realize they have something to offer, that gives meaning to us. It's that simple. Why do we fear that? Because if we offer too much we reveal much of ourselves and others using that against us. So we keep it to ourselves and use that to defend ourselves from others who would do such a thing. Most would not, but it IS those others that concerns us most and subsequently all lose in that selfishness.

GM, that is what life is about and reaching that paradigm that will give a sense of meaning to all; and we are far from that. As I have offered many times, our existence thus far has be an orientation and an indoctrination to what life is meant to be. We cannot know a heaven until we first experience what the opposite of that and what we, collectively agree heaven is NOT. Some call that hell; it doesn't matter what you call it, we innately know what we have existed for, so far, is not heaven and it is our purpose in life to create that heaven, and we never will. Not in it's entirety.

It's the journey to that, is what is important. Once it is understood all who are here are on that same journey will we offer what we can, without fear of losing anything, to others knowing in it all, we will derive benefit from that without ever asking for anything. All for one and one for all. Most, at present, are just to selfish to consider such a thing. Why, because we are impatient, that's why. We want it all before our end comes when there is no end. So we create a paradox that is not a paradox.

Hence................what's the use. How we think is very important and when we think of others before self we will answer those questions for they will answer them for us. And they is all but the "I" and when we all do that, the I becomes extinct and we give it no concern.

gotmilk9991;94562 wrote:
What is the point when thousands, maybe even hundreds of years from now, noone will be around to remember our (your mean "your") accomplishments and failures, short of geographical failures.


Sorry GM for offering more to your quote. You use "we" and "our" so you will not feel alone in your offering. Don't be offended for I have done that too because "I" is a part of that all and no "one" wants to be held responsible for they (the "I" that is them) do not want to assume any responsibility for any wrong they have committed in the hindrance of that journey. So they "excuse" themselves and speak from a lonely platform but use we so they will not have to admit to it themselves.

Life, for us, the human being, is simple, we just make it difficult. It's like a puzzle of many pieces and no one knows what the final picture will be. Not even God himself, though we think He does and that causes much confusion. We as one with that God will create that picture and it will never be finished as putting the pieces together is what life is about when all are allowed to offer the piece that they are and represent.

We are a dynamic lot, you and I, and we need to do something in it all for those who are left out, they become bored and do cause a whole hell of a lot of trouble. Most don't though and shrivel up and die. Not in the, like dead sense, but in the sense of dead weight the others of us have to carry as we are responsible for killing any life others could have had if we only offered what we could so they to could live and be a part. See List.

So to answer the question asked in the thread, no "one" can. It will take a group effort and unless we understand that and in all we do, strive to accomplish that, life will never have meaning and that is what hell is all about. It is just a matter of endurance.

gotmilk9991;94562 wrote:
But even then, those will have no meaning and are finite. Why do we try?


And last, to think us finite, is the root of the problem. As far as the future, you will be there and you will remember all the good that was you in all your existence as you realize you were and are now and will always be. You not believing that is why you think as you do now. Once you do you will become to realize how so very important others are in your life and what it is. For without them, life is a very lonely place to be.

William
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Sun 27 Dec, 2009 07:11 am
@Reconstructo,
Reconstructo;111933 wrote:
This sounds pretty spot-on to me. Well put.


Kant said that the point of life is not happiness, but deserved happiness. (Please don't ask me what "deserved" means. That's not the issue).
 
Elmud
 
Reply Sun 27 Dec, 2009 08:08 am
@gotmilk9991,
to quote an old friend of mine,,everyones looking for somethin. -"somethin to do".
 
salima
 
Reply Sun 27 Dec, 2009 08:33 am
@Deckard,
Deckard;112060 wrote:
I think a lot of people come up with this idea all by themselves. Also the idea that God was lonely so he split himself up into separate consciousnesses. I'm not too worried about whether it makes sense. I do wonder if there are any established religions that actually espouse this sort of theology. Is there some ancient teaching of the bored and lonely God or is this a newer new age development?


i think it is somewhere in hindu philosophy-which part of the books i dont know. but it's an old one...i think of it more along the lines of a natural course for the evolution of the original consciousness which has come to be called god.

but somewhere there is a post that someone made that made me see how it could have been intentional...
 
William
 
Reply Sun 27 Dec, 2009 09:48 am
@kennethamy,
kennethamy;114619 wrote:
Kant said that the point of life is not happiness, but deserved happiness. (Please don't ask me what "deserved" means. That's not the issue).


Deserved indicates a condition that is of a reward for works. I think entitled is a better term. Now we think it is a reward for those who work the hardest and because of that they deserve "more". That would be true if those rewards were bestowed by those who benefited from such hard work. But he who is selfless is not interested in such stuff and doubt very seriously if they would be. It is observing what you offer to others and what they benefit is what matters and in that act of giving, the giver receives his reward.

Yes, there could very well be "perks", but such a person would never be happy with more for more's sake.

Most who are giving don't need the recognition, for they have already received what they need. There is a universal justice that works all well and good and that is all the reward anyone needs. It's a mind MIND thing.

William
 
NecromanticSin
 
Reply Wed 6 Jan, 2010 11:16 am
@Khethil,
Khethil;94565 wrote:

I think that no matter how we slice and dice it, we end up giving our own existence value - or a point - or not.

.... just my take



agreed. I often wonder why people are so worried about what they do on this earth,and how when they pass,as the years go by and maybe soon enough *if* in fact the world ends,that their foot prints on this earth didn't matter. I understand we all want to be important, to be known, to be remembered, to be looked up to at one point or another. However when it comes down to it, you are just one single tiny person on this earth with so many other just ''people'',and it's very far in between that there are those whos foot prints cover the rest of ours.
I stopped trying to find comfort in ''the meaning'' of life,beacuse I give meaning to my life. That is that. And when I die, that is that. There is no more,no less. If i did good on this earth,it will remain in the memories of th people who experienced it, if i did something to change the world,it will go noticed til the next person comes along,and so on.

Creating your own value,your own life is the meaning of life if there ever was one.
 
 

 
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