Sight beyond the visible spectrum

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Reply Fri 15 May, 2009 07:34 pm
Can we get an idea, using logic and imagination, of what it must be like to be able to see into the infrared and ultraviolet sides of the electromagnetic spectrum?
I have an inkling of what this must look like.
To do this one must have basic knowledge of wave-form math and music theory.

Our hearing can perceive several octaves of music. High 'e' and low 'e' have two fundamental similarities. They both sound similar, and the one is exactly double the wave form of the other. High 'e' is said to be 'brighter' than low 'e'.

In visible light we can only see 1 range of colors. In musical terms this is analogous to being able to hear only 1 octave.

So if we could see light with twice the frequency of middle-green, it would actually look much like green except it would be 'brighter' and have a perceptable 'higher' energy value. Low green would be 'dull' in much the same way that low 'e' is a dull version of middle 'e'.

Now, how can we be sure that ALL people can actually only see the visible spectrum? Well we cannot be certain, we can only guess that MOST people do. Its impossible to test everyone.

Any person that claims to be able to see things that others cannot, is said to be suffering from 'hallucinations'. Is it not highly probable that some people under certain conditions can actually see things that others cannot?

Now if these people are a significantly small minority, would it also not follow that they would be seen perhaps as 'mutants', or 'insane'? In much the same way, the first people to speculate that the sun is the center of the solar system were terribly persecuted.

And, given that such is occuring, it would be presumptuous to believe that all such people were actually seeing the same phenomena. Some may be seeing higher light, other's lower light.

Also, perhaps it is possible to 'see' bands of electromagnetic waves that are actually far removed from the spectrum of visible light, and be blind to the bandwidths inbetween. It could even be a moving faculty which is not trained to one area of bandwidth.

Sense perception requires training too. As musicians sharpen their skills, they are able to distinguish sound in far more detail than the laymans ear. They can pick out tiny errors in music which us normal folk are blind to. So to actually prove this idea is not something that can be done with a simple one-off test.

As an amateur muso, I know that when I do not play for a week or more, my ability lapses very quickly. So concentrated training of such notions requires nurturing, patience, and prejudgemental pre-concieved notions can be a great hindrance.

Are there any examples of people claiming to be able to see things that others cannot?
;-j
 
validity
 
Reply Sat 16 May, 2009 03:27 am
@Poseidon,
Interesting.

Perhaps many can see slightly further into the ultraviolet and infrared ends of the EM spectrum. Perhaps those who do, are not aware as the brain may not invent new colours and end up just stretching the width of the pre-existing colours to accomodate the new range.

A review of the work of Claude Monet may hold a clue Aphakia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
sarathustrah
 
Reply Sat 16 May, 2009 08:29 am
@Poseidon,
this is most likely completely unrelated and im suffering from an excruciating earache and im just tryin to distract myself... but in the past i experimented with a few substances in a "psychonaut" type of way... when taking a controlled overdose of coricidin (cold medicine: dextromethorphane hydrobromide and pseudophedrine) i had an experience i still cant explain... this reminded me of it...
and im no expert so it could be a hallucination type deal dont know the exact chemistry of it all... although hallucinating is not really an effect i experienced in those experiments, i did have blurred vision and my imagination would take over and at times i would be kinda dreaming with my eyes open but it definitly was recognizably not a hallucination and just vivid imagination.
but my friend and i were pushing each others hands together to feel the effects on our muscles and i seen a type of yellow radiating from our hands... i stared at it while my friends eyes were still shut. when she opened them without me saying anything, she said "woah i see like a yellow aura" ...same as i saw.
but it was only visible while pushing our hands together.
 
ogden
 
Reply Sat 16 May, 2009 09:17 am
@Poseidon,
Is it logical to reason that others can perceive infrared?

I think it is perfectly logical to reason that human reproduction involves the possibility of mutations that could allow someone to have abilities beyond that of the common majority. And when selection pressure rewards them for it, the mutation will proliferate. If there is no selection pressure and no reward, then it's just an anomaly.

We are the way we are because it works. Our physiology is structured to enable us to occupy our condition. If we were all forced to live in underground it would be logical to expect a new set of abilities to emerge from our genetics with enhanced low light vision or the ability to produce vitamin D or something else useful in occupying the new conditions.
 
sarathustrah
 
Reply Sat 16 May, 2009 10:21 am
@ogden,
ogden's post reminds me of the episode of fringe where they find the boy living underground
 
Bones-O
 
Reply Sat 16 May, 2009 11:16 am
@Poseidon,
There must be some variation in the range boundaries of perceived EM spectrum. I've thought about this myself: we should all mate with people who can see IR and UV radiation to help the species evolve. :a-ok:

I imagine the variation is very small compared to the total range, and that the highest frequencies are still seen as violet and the lowest as red.

However, the highest visible frequency is ~790 THz, almost twice the lowest red freq. (~400 THz). And violet does look like a redder blue... so... maybe. :shifty:
 
Aedes
 
Reply Sat 16 May, 2009 11:25 am
@Poseidon,
Poseidon wrote:
Can we get an idea, using logic and imagination, of what it must be like to be able to see into the infrared and ultraviolet sides of the electromagnetic spectrum?
We can see UV and infrared quite easily, without needing imagination. Many photographic films are sensitive far beyond the visible spectrum -- you just need a filter that blocks out visible light.

Do a search and you'll find infrared photography EVERYWHERE on the internet, it's a trendy thing in photography. Tends to make foliage very white, blue skies very dark, skin tones look sort of dreamy.

UV phtography is a lot harder, because most photographic glass will block UV light. So you need fluorite lens elements -- Nikon makes a $3000 lens that will do this, and it's mainly used for forensics. This website, however, shows some artistic photography with it using normal color film, a fluorite lens, and a UV filter that cuts out visible light. You can't take "scenery" shots with UV photography because there's so much blue and UV scatter in the atmostphere that it would make the photo uselessly blurry.

Ultaviolet Photography in Colour

I took my avatar photo using Rollei infrared film and a filter that blocks wavelengths shorter than ~720 nm.

You can rightly comment that what we're looking at in this photograph, be it the digital image or the original film / print, is NOT infrared, but rather visible light.

However, this image was produced solely by the reflection of infrared light through my lens and onto my film; the lighter values are produced by a higher intensity of IR light, and the darker values the opposite.

http://www.pbase.com/drpablo74/image/71621739.jpg
 
Poseidon
 
Reply Thu 11 Jun, 2009 06:22 pm
@Poseidon,
great Sarathustra,
You intuited exactly what i was hoping someone would.
anyone read 'The doors of perception - heaven and hell' by Aldous Huxley?
 
 

 
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