Intellectual property rights

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Reply Sat 7 Feb, 2009 10:52 am
Record labels as agencies for live gigs, where users upload mp3 songs which are then owned by the label in return for promotion.

I think this is quite a good format for online business, but what are the discrepancies in the property rights of the individual? If somebody were to upload a song then edit it and go on to sell the song privately, would this be an infringement of copyright laws? It's as if somebody made an accurate copy of a famous artwork and sold it as an original piece of work - is this a crime, or simply ethically undermining of one of either pieces?
 
VideCorSpoon
 
Reply Sat 7 Feb, 2009 12:13 pm
@Doobah47,
So if what I gather is correct, you support the fact that the Record label acts as an agent for a "live gig" which I am assuming is the artist, band, etc. The users then upload the mp3 song (owned by the label). But are you implying that the user is entitled to promotional costs for uploading the song?

Legally speaking, the property rights pertaining to music and intellectual property centers around copyrights. In a copyright, the right of the writer (i.e. artist, originator) has automatic and exclusive rights to their work for a given amount of time. The copyright extends for 70 years after the originator dies, 95 years for the publisher from publication, or 120 years after creation of the original work. During that time, the originator (i.e. the artist, publisher) can file for actual damages plus profits received from the infringing party or statutory damages under the Copyright Act of 1976 plus
 
sarathustrah
 
Reply Sat 7 Feb, 2009 12:27 pm
@Doobah47,
all this legal mumbo jumbo is waaay beyond me...

if you ask me... a musician who performs music is entitled to payment... if you wrote an awesome thought provoking song, and i performed it and received money for a good performance... i dont believe you deserve any money... of course before i play it i should legally have to give you credit for writing it, but not money for writing it....

all this mp3 business and money for each download is like getting money for each time its played on the radio... its pure greed and outrageous

a musician should be able to make a comfortable living off of performances alone... and even merchandise sales...

you cant disguise greed as fairness...
 
VideCorSpoon
 
Reply Sat 7 Feb, 2009 12:34 pm
@Doobah47,
But doesn't that seem unfair to the music writer who may for all intensive purposes rely on those payments for his/her song to make even more thought provoking songs. Music artists need to eat and pay their bills too... although, I do in many respects think that music artists get paid a little too much for what they do. But that's relative to the market they are in. If a music artist should have credit, they should also have the opportunity to profit from what is credited. Otherwise, there is more hubris and ego than greed.

I wouldn't say that most of the profits from a given song are pure greed though. They fuel a market that is then able to push many more bands which would otherwise not be funded in the first place by record labels. Think of all the smaller bands that would have had the opportunity to be signed by the profits of other bands under the same label. The music industry is very symbiotic in many respects.
 
sarathustrah
 
Reply Sat 7 Feb, 2009 12:55 pm
@Doobah47,
well i was imagining the musician as the writer... thats right... i forget that poets call themselves song writers now and sell the material to ppl who can perform...

when i used that example i was imagining instances of cover bands getting sued

like how i can quote anyone in a book so long as i say they said it right... i theorized it was the same with the song... the song writer/poet should be able to sell the material... but they then dont get paid for each time its sung y'know...

truthfully this position is used to defend the ability to download songs...

it is more complicated than i initially gave thought to who deserves what payment for what degree of effort they put in.... *sigh*

like i dont even know how a band distributes its money... does the bassist who is often said of having the easiest instrument get less than the drummer? it really involves alot of forever arguable opinions...

the whole labels and industry and that type of stuff really gets to me... i could discuss a number of related things...
 
VideCorSpoon
 
Reply Sat 7 Feb, 2009 01:35 pm
@sarathustrah,
could download the heck out of every new movie or CD they would want and technically not get in trouble for it because it is not technically illegal. I don't know if anyone remembers, but in the very beginning of the music download craze, there was Napster. They are irrelevant now, but why have they received the full brunt of the intellectual copyright assault? The reasons have less to do with the actual songs or the copyright laws themselves more than it has to do with the medium in which they are spread. Napster used a centralized network that specifically contributed to copyright infringement. Kazaa and Morpheus that followed went around that issue be decentralizing the exchange of songs and movies. MuTorrent completely removed centralization all together. Dilute a pool long enough and all you have left to prosecute is dirty water, with millions and millions of people becoming the point of origins for a single file. It's a legal improbability that (for now at least) is unsolvable.
 
manored
 
Reply Sun 8 Feb, 2009 12:29 pm
@Doobah47,
I think that the biggest potential (not yet a problem) problem of copyright is the decision of whenever someone copied something from someone else or not. I mean if I and some other guy wrote the same story out of an incredible coincidence, could any of us have the exclusive rights to that story just because we had the idea before the other? What could be claimed to give who the reason?
 
VideCorSpoon
 
Reply Sun 8 Feb, 2009 02:41 pm
@manored,
Vanilla: No, our songs are completely different.
Reporter: How so?
Vanilla: See, my song goes "Ding ding ding ding ding ding DUM 'ting" but the song under pressure's beat goes like "Ding ding ding ding ding ding DUM" idea. The only way a copyright can be successfully applied is if the particular way an idea is expressed. But really, is it that impossible to copyright an idea?

So in the example of the two men experiencing the same event, which one is entitled to write about it? The simple answer is that, the right belongs to whoever copyrights it first. Sucks, but that seems to be the gist of it.
 
manored
 
Reply Mon 9 Feb, 2009 02:24 pm
@Doobah47,
Yeah, sucks Sad

But that legislation seens strange, because it seens to be it leaves nothing to copyright at all. A recipe to a medicine can, for example, be considered a discovery.
 
Ola
 
Reply Thu 12 Feb, 2009 10:06 am
@Doobah47,
(btw?)
Intellectual property rights should be protected in a market economy but only in a totalitarian state could integrity invasion in doing so be accepted.
It is really up to the industry to protect their product.
Privacy is of a higher priority than their profits.
 
Victor Eremita
 
Reply Fri 13 Feb, 2009 12:05 am
@Doobah47,
My opinion on Copyrights is that the Berne Convention of the length of copyright being life of the author + 50 years is reasonable and fair. A certain amount of time must pass before profits can be made on the author's work, 50 is a reasonable length of time because its long enough for the author's heirs to continue to protect the work, but short enough so that others can share in the work. The Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension Act in the United States is one of the most selfish acts ever passed, forcing works into 95 year ranges.
 
 

 
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