Can't get any dumber, that's for sure.

Can I get stronger by exercising out of the gym? yes.
Your mind can exercise in many ways and I don't see why it can't get that while dreaming...especially if you learn something about yourself from it.

You need to recall whether you were passively watching yourself and an Amish man debate- in which case all you can do is try to recall the dream in the morning and learn from what was said, or; were you actually debating with an Amish man? This would require you to be some what lucid within the dream so that you could choose your points of debate. If you were able to differentiate and work out whether you were lucid and actually debating, or passive and merely observing yourself debating then I would suggest that if you were lucid then most likely, yes, you will be learning in the same way as if you debated in reality- at the very least your subconscious would be taking note of the events.

Is any one on the forums lucky enough to be a natural lucid dreamer? Or has anyone ever tried to induce lucidity? I had a friend at college who suffered from terrible sleep paralysis, but it came with wonderfully lucid dreams where he had almost 100% control of setting, people and physics. I think you can imagine what he spent most his time choosing to dream about at the age of 17, lucky SOB.

Dan.

It was a first person discussion, and this is often the case in the various dreams I have. (sometime 4 or 5 a night)

The interesting part about these 'philosophical dreams' I have, is that I usually recall thinking as I would in real life. Words don't just come out of my mouth, they are thoughtful words that sometimes require a pause on my part to choose how to phrase them.



I suppose I am about 30% of the time. I realize that nothing like this would happen to me in real life and that I must be dreaming, so I make 'conscious' decisions to go forth with my actions (like adultery, for example).

Which brings up a thought I had a while ago: If we are lucid in our dreams and choose unethical actions, should we be held responsible for those actions?

Well you are very lucky, a little practice and you could have complete control I'm sure. Two simple techniques to help are...

(a) When you wake up, lay still recall your dreams and write them down, this increases your overall awareness of your dreams.
(b) If you don't have one get a watch, you need to get into the habit of using it as a dream detector. There is no sense of time in a dream, so in a dream if you look at the watch, note the time and then look at it again it will either jump forward, go backwards or have letters on it or something. If you can get into the habit of checking the time (in reality) in such a manner that you check once, look away and check again you will be able to start to use it in your dreams as a genuine dream detector when you suspect but aren't sure. Apparently some people awake in a dream, check the watch and it is straight to the sex, lol.

Have you ever said anything new or worked out anything new in a dream?
That would be something amazing, to go to sleep with a problem, solve it in your dreams and then awake with not only a good nights sleep but one less problem.

Dan.

You are wholly right,de Silentio.Dreams sometimes fortuitously prognosticate the future,sometimes it is a veneer,a harrowing ordeal.

Dreams doesn't invariably make one mind smarter,you cannot remember them once you are wide awake,but solely a portion of it.

You dream chiefly because you have an ennui.These dreams bring the dreamer into an unforeseen place,sometimes he might get a merit or demerit.

A fellow lucid dreamer Blasted lucid dreams present so many problems!

To answer the initial question: I think that because our mind is constantly working and constantly honing various things in the background, I am prone to believing that while we dream we can hone certain other skills, especially if we're lucidly dreaming (how would it be to take a problem into a world with no boundaries except those which we create, and find a solution? But then, that's probably exactly why not many problems get solved that way...).

Actually, come to think of it, we often take problems into our dreams with us, they're just more often the emotional ones - consider a series of "chase" dreams...chances are pretty high that those dreams are being formed because of a sense of or fear of some sort of persecution in real life. For me, whenever I have a series of dreams, and then figure out why I'm having that particular formula placed before me nightly, then they stop.

That was sort of rambly...I'm pretty tired despite it being nearly noon.

The question in this thread that interested me more is the ethical one:

My first thought was: Only so far as we should be held responsible for daydreams or other thoughts or imagined scenes.

Then I got to thinking about that. After all, there are many people who believe that you've committed a "sin" whether you just thought it or acted it.

I don't think thinking is the same as action, because for me out thoughts are ours alone. Our mind is our only true domain. But it is noteworthy that the only way to act on a thought is to have the thought in the first place. And to have contemplated an action outside our normal moral code, whatever that may be...does that not make us more susceptible to acting on that thought in the future?

I wonder also...If we really can hone thinking skills while dreaming, does it help at all to practice our moral code (assuming one can lucid dream, anyway) while sleeping?

Speaking of sleep, I'm going to go get some more of it. :bigsmile: