The Future.

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Reply Sun 4 May, 2008 04:59 pm
The future is often enough the controlling mechanism of politics and governments in which exchanges of promises are made in order to bait the populance into submission metaphysically where a certain amount of people claim a sort of special authority.

If you don't agree with my sentiments what exactly is the use in talking or describing what is seemingly called the future?

Even more interesting if we accept that the cosmos or universe is indeed a relative one that destroys our mythological narrative of some final destination or mass purpose of mankind.


Person 1: The future will save us all. The future is a bright better new tomorrow. The future represents progress.

Person 2: Have you ever seen the future? Have you ever experienced the future? Have you ever touched and felt the presence of the future to know what the future holds?

Person 1: Well... um... no.

Person 2: What is the future, then?

Person 1: ( Silent.)
 
Arjen
 
Reply Mon 5 May, 2008 10:23 am
@Pessimist,
I think what you are pointing to is that we "exist" in what people call "the now". By existing not only "now", but also "here" we can get very close to simply "existing". When "existing" one can experience things around in a much clear way. Things around work in on the consciousness in an "energetic" manner and as such one can, if one is quiet enough in oneself, "experience" things a long way from the "here". The same goes for experienceing "the now"; it is linked with everywhen in a way which is unfathomable to us I sometimes think. The crazy part of it is that when realising this cognitively this "existence" is severed.

Is this in anyway valuable to you?
 
GoshisDead
 
Reply Mon 5 May, 2008 01:08 pm
@Pessimist,
That is like saying
Person 1: The past will teach us all. The past is the memory of our mistakes and conquests. The past shows us our progress.

Person 2: Can you see the past? Can yo experience the past? Can you touch, see, sense the past, and prove what the past held?


Person 1: Well... um... no.

Person 2: What is the past, then?

Person 1: ( Silent.)

Memory is the only thing that shows that past was real, it is what tells us there will be a future, there has been a past since memory which has turned into a future. One cannot exist without the other, although you can't prove either was or will be real. therefore it is completely legitimate to refer to the possible future, whether or not it is likely thatthe future will be better.
 
Pessimist
 
Reply Mon 5 May, 2008 03:01 pm
@Arjen,
Arjen wrote:
I think what you are pointing to is that we "exist" in what people call "the now". By existing not only "now", but also "here" we can get very close to simply "existing". When "existing" one can experience things around in a much clear way. Things around work in on the consciousness in an "energetic" manner and as such one can, if one is quiet enough in oneself, "experience" things a long way from the "here". The same goes for experienceing "the now"; it is linked with everywhen in a way which is unfathomable to us I sometimes think. The crazy part of it is that when realising this cognitively this "existence" is severed.

Is this in anyway valuable to you?



I'm merely saying that we in actuality have no understanding of the future in that projections of the subject always remain dreamed or imagined.

Yet ironically such dreams and imaginations of a subject that is completely unexpirienced, unforseen or unknown has come to dominate us all in a strange sort of way.

GoshisDead wrote:
That is like saying
Person 1: The past will teach us all. The past is the memory of our mistakes and conquests. The past shows us our progress.

Person 2: Can you see the past? Can yo experience the past? Can you touch, see, sense the past, and prove what the past held?

Person 1: Well... um... no.

Person 2: What is the past, then?

Person 1: ( Silent.)

Memory is the only thing that shows that past was real, it is what tells us there will be a future, there has been a past since memory which has turned into a future. One cannot exist without the other, although you can't prove either was or will be real. therefore it is completely legitimate to refer to the possible future, whether or not it is likely thatthe future will be better.


But since memory isn't adequate enough to understand the past as we all die along with our memories we resort to writing in recordance which leads to interpretation but since writing can't accurately record everything it also leads to distortion of information as well.

Quote:

it is what tells us there will be a future,
How exactly.

There could possibly be a day where everything is destroyed where there will be no future and history has no control or specific vision on that.

Quote:

there has been a past since memory which has turned into a future
Since the future is unexpirienced by all of us in the present ( Past included) it is always discussed and driven by desires, fantasies, or flights of fancy. Nothing more.

Quote:

One cannot exist without the other, although you can't prove either was or will be real. therefore it is completely legitimate to refer to the possible future, whether or not it is likely thatthe future will be better.
If we really wanted to get complicated and epistemological we could say that all meanings are social fabrications in that through actuality there only exists one single flow of existence.

All I'm merely saying is that the future is a theoretical guessing game and in many ways thrives on people's delusional fantasies or mythologies.

Even more interesting is how governments and people of authority survive solely on people's delusional fears of the future which at the same time they threaten people's perceived futures too in order to bait individuals into obedience.

The government has strictly become a religion of the future.
 
GoshisDead
 
Reply Mon 5 May, 2008 03:20 pm
@Pessimist,
Quote:
All I'm merely saying is that the future is a theoretical guessing game and in many ways thrives on people's delusional fantasies or mythologies.

So is history.......
 
Pessimist
 
Reply Mon 5 May, 2008 03:22 pm
@GoshisDead,
GoshisDead wrote:
So is history.......


Sure. I agree. Wink
 
Justin
 
Reply Wed 7 May, 2008 12:09 pm
@Pessimist,
Pessimist wrote:


Person 1: The future will save us all. The future is a bright better new tomorrow. The future represents progress.

Person 2: Have you ever seen the future? Have you ever experienced the future? Have you ever touched and felt the presence of the future to know what the future holds?

Person 1: Well... um... no.

Person 2: What is the future, then?

Person 1: ( Silent.)


Person 1 (not silent): The future is what each of us make of it. The future is all we have ahead of us, all that is behind, is behind us. You and I and all those among us are responsible for the future.

Person 2: Never thought of it that way. Here I was trying to describe a tangible asset that could be touched and felt.

Person 1: You can choose to go through life blindfolded and allow others to create your future or you can create it for yourself. The choice is ultimately yours.

Person 2: But I'm a pessimist and your romanticism on life is just nonsense. Why don't you join me in seeing the negative in all things... We can both be miserable together and allow everything outside of us to determine our furture... I know it's dark and the future holds nothing good for anyone.

Person 1: I will not join you in your way of thinking as I view it as unproductive and dismal.

Choose your future wisely and furthermore choose your thoughts on it carefully. You are and will become that what you think most often. Your future is up to you and your future is that which you will create of it.

Person 1 - Quickly leaves the room before he catches a disease he wants no part of.
 
kennethamy
 
Reply Thu 8 May, 2008 06:36 am
@Pessimist,
Pessimist wrote:
The future is often enough the controlling mechanism of politics and governments in which exchanges of promises are made in order to bait the populance into submission metaphysically where a certain amount of people claim a sort of special authority.

If you don't agree with my sentiments what exactly is the use in talking or describing what is seemingly called the future?

Even more interesting if we accept that the cosmos or universe is indeed a relative one that destroys our mythological narrative of some final destination or mass purpose of mankind.


Person 1: The future will save us all. The future is a bright better new tomorrow. The future represents progress.

Person 2: Have you ever seen the future? Have you ever experienced the future? Have you ever touched and felt the presence of the future to know what the future holds?

Person 1: Well... um... no.

Person 2: What is the future, then?

Person 1: ( Silent.)


As Bertrand Russell points out, we have all experienced past futures, but not future futures. Today, I experience a past future (what was the future yesterday). And tomorrow I will experience a past future again. Namely, the future today. So, the important thing here is to distinguish between past futures, and future futures.
 
nameless
 
Reply Sat 17 May, 2008 06:22 pm
@Pessimist,
Pessimist wrote:
The future is often enough the controlling mechanism of politics and governments in which exchanges of promises are made in order to bait the populance into submission metaphysically where a certain amount of people claim a sort of special authority.

As you say, it is the 'promises' (lies and misdirection, of course) that manipulate the electorate, not 'the future', which is no more than words and concepts (since it doesnt exist as other than that).

All moments actually exist synchronously. 'Past' and 'future' are illusions from a particular perspective. Science says that there is no reason not to be able to 'remember' the 'future' as well as the 'past'. I have found this to be accurate.
All moments are Here/Now!
 
No0ne
 
Reply Mon 19 May, 2008 08:09 pm
@nameless,
nameless wrote:
As you say, it is the 'promises' (lies and misdirection, of course) that manipulate the electorate, not 'the future', which is no more than words and concepts (since it doesnt exist as other than that).

All moments actually exist synchronously. 'Past' and 'future' are illusions from a particular perspective. Science says that there is no reason not to be able to 'remember' the 'future' as well as the 'past'. I have found this to be accurate.
All moments are Here/Now!


Ha.. well done.. yet here is a great example which can support that concept.

If you walking in some sand, you turn around and see were you once walked, the proof is the foot prints in made in that sand therfore you can see the past step's you took in your mind and in the physical world around you, yet if you look forward, you dont see the foot print's in the sand in front of you, for you have not made them yet, for you may only see them in your thought's, not in the physical world around you.

Yet the real word's are in parable format which is (For my feet are no more in the sand i walked, for the path i make ahead are my feet aswell lay not in the sand?)

The other half is (As i walk again within the sand, the winds of this land blow, and i no longer see where is was or where i will be, for i no longer can see my past step's withen the sand. Have i lost my sight of time aswell?)

So the past present and future are at one withen are mind's bound by are ability to difine the information that we have withen are mind's, yet that is all bound by are or other's perception of it all...

So you are 100% correct when you say exist synchronously.

yet the reason why, would be that we are allways or allmost allways thinking of what you just did, what are you doing, and what will you do, hence the thought of the past present and future are as one with one another, mainly because each one couldnt be without the other, the reason why is

The past present and future all happen at the same time, hence they are just words made to define a perceptable action that people have observed before we existed.

The reason why they all happen at the same time is.

The present dosnt last, the future become's your present just to become your past, all withen an instant synchronously within your self


You make your present, you make your past, you make your future, But it never lasts ^^
______________________________________________________
but for you complex nerde peep's here is a tuff one to follow ^^

The future is the past that you made in the present.

This one is a tuff concept about the 3 observed effect's and perception from one point within perceptable time, to another point within perceptable time.

So if you think of the past in the present it effect's or changes your future that become's your present(as you think of it or see it) then become's your past ^^ so all 3 action's allways happen at the same time. your thoughts will allways be the future the present and the past at the same time you think of them. Truely synchronous action of perception of 3 difrent time's in your mind, left for you to define ^^

So thats the MAIN REASON WHY (All moment's or thinking exist synchronously with one another within one point of perceptable time within are mind)

Thank you all for your time, in reading this (Injoy)

Hope Time Fly's Who Know's Why ^.^
 
charles m young
 
Reply Sat 12 Jul, 2008 09:02 pm
@No0ne,
This is a very simple subject. This can also very well turn into a complicated subject. The future is in all actuality unpredictable, however controllable. Cause and effect is a measurable and practical science, and the effect always follows the cause. Thus by calculating the result of an action, factoring in all the variable results based on condition, environment and motion in inertia, you can somewhat control the future with precision.

The human mind is a flighty and complex, not to mention highly unpredictable object to attempt to control, and until you have a positive feel for the functioning of the mind, both cause and effect, you would endeavor to control it with miserable failure. Physical future predictions are practical and simple with proper calculation, but social and mental future prediction is a fine feat indeed. But even our physical mind can be broken down into a science, and the laws of probability can somewhat predict our reaction. More popular forms of social persuasion and 'future controlling' is fear. Ask someone politely to give you 10,000 dollars. It didn't work? Try this: put a gun to a bankers head and tell her to open the safe. Ah, now that was a lot easier! Congratulations, you just won 10,000 dollars and a one way ticket to jail! Do not pass go, do not collect 200 dollars, you just stole 10,000 anyway.

My point is this: your actions and words have great influence on the outcome of the future. To produce the results of the future, you must first control it. Affect the causes generated in a persons mind to dictate or predict the future effect, or result if you will. This is the simple solution for knowing what the future hold. You can touch it, you just have to reach out a little.
 
boagie
 
Reply Sun 13 Jul, 2008 10:53 am
@nameless,
Smile
Time is not, for it self implodes, it rejoins itself in its inner folds, it streams, it ebbs, it flows, implodes, all cycles within contained in whole, time is not for it self emplodes, it-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
No0ne
 
Reply Mon 4 Aug, 2008 04:04 pm
@boagie,
boagie wrote:
Smile
Time is not, for it self implodes, it rejoins itself in its inner folds, it streams, it ebbs, it flows, implodes, all cycles within contained in whole, time is not for it self emplodes, it-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Here are two puzzles about "Hologram Time Travel"

1. I'm Object (A), The Moon is Object (B), The Light Source Is Object (C),
You Are Object (D)

A. The Light From (C) Reflects Off Object (A) To Object (B) Then To Object (D) To See And Perceive.

B. If The Light That Was Reflected Off Of Object (A) To (B) Was 1/4 The Speed Of Light, When The Light Gets To Object (D) To See And Perceive Would Object (D) See The Light In The Future?

Hence could you project a hologram of your self into the future to give a message to your self in the future?

Now the next one is very tricky...

2. I'm Object (A), The Moon is Object (B), The Light Source Is Object (C),
You Are Object (D)

A. The Light From (C) Reflects Off Object (A) To Object (B) Then To Object (D) To See And Perceive.

B. If The Light That Was Reflected Off Of Object (A) To (B) Was 3 Time's The Speed Of Light, When The Light Gets To Object (D) To See And Perceive Would Object (D) See The Light In The Past?

Or would (D) see it sooner in the future than if the light was 1/4 the speed?

Hence can one only project the image into the future and never into the past?

( I Know the answer's already I will post them to these puzzles In 3-day's)
 
johncee phil
 
Reply Thu 7 Aug, 2008 10:00 am
@Pessimist,
Pessimist wrote:
"The future is often enough the controlling mechanism of politics and governments in which exchanges of promises are made in order to bait the populance into submission metaphysically where a certain amount of people claim a sort of special authority."

The future is not the controlling mechanism of politics it is the social system we live under capitalism. Parliament is the arena based on the social system we live under. The writer forgets that parliament is a house the rich build in order to further their rule and sway including the looting of the resources and economy. An example being the current predatory home loan scandal known throughout the industry as "liar loans".
The politicians have to appeal to the majority through lying and promises they have no intention of keeping because they defend the financial elite "big money" and "big business".

As well, the past determines the future to a great degree but the subjective intervention of people can and do intervene in order to change the future. Otherwise pessimist you are implying that it is all in the hands of the future or it is worshipping the accomplished fact before it has even occurred - hence most likely the source of your pessimism.

"the populance into submission"?
The population are not into submission. As well, the population are made up of classes and the working class is an oppressed class who have been on the sidelines for a long period. But that is because their old perspective of trade union struggles based on national reformism has collapsed and no longer viable. Production and economic life have been globalised, and to fight today, workers have to unite their struggles internationally with their class brothers and sisters and fight for genuine social justice and social equality that is genuine socialism.
 
 

 
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