Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
It's not my place to say whether you're welcome here. However, I will say this: Your moral reasoning sucks. There's a difference between forgiving someone for a wrong they've done and holding a person accountable for a crime. Child abuse is a crime, and it doesn't suddenly stop being a crime just because TFI leadership no longer openly teache the members to abuse children. A few vaguely worded apologies doesn't mean they've repented the harm they did to a generation. Zerby and Kelly have NEVER ONCE confessed that Berg's teachings on child/adult sex were FLAT OUT WRONG.

It's easy to preach forgiveness if you weren't raped or beaten or your child wasn't raped or beaten. So you had a mostly good experience--how nice for you. I agree that spiritual healing ultimately involves some form of forgiveness, but for many people, forgiveness isn't possible until there is justice. Can there be peace without justice? It isn't my place or YOURS to tell a victim how to go about healing the wounds inflicted by unrepentant criminals. Being raped or beaten and shamed repeatedly isn't something you just get over and forget. If you want to put some "meat" on your counsel of forgiveness, why not offer to pay the psychiatric bills for the Family's child abuse victims?

What would Jesus do? I was a member, but I'm not familiar with the song. Whatever the song says Jesus would do is probably a crock of shit, because Family theology sucks. What Berg, Zerby & Kelly think Jesus would do is pimp out his female followers and have sex with male disciples while they fantasize in prayer about being females. Where does Jesus tell his followers to forgive and speak well of false prophets who teach such perverse doctrine? I challenge you to find one place in the Bible where Jesus tells his followers to forgive someone who refuses to repent. God doesn't forgive the unrepentant, so why should Jesus' disciples? What would Jesus do? Look in your Bible for the answer to that one: Matt. 18:6-7; Mark 9:42-43; Luke 17:1-3.

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
wow, ur a bitter piece of work. Try crucifixion before you get on your high horse and tell of the crimes of this world.
Your entitled to curse out the Family, if you wish. Hey why not blame God for creating satan in the first place., the buck has got to stop somewhere?
Life is a struggle and my experiences were anything but Joyful...of which I will not elaborate on.
So apart from the sex... what else is wrong with the Family? They try hard to serve Jesus in His great mission. To you the religious system is correct hey?
Like I said your entitled to your hatred, you are not alone so many hate these people.
But me I love anyone who in sincerity wishes to serve Jesus and not the System/Satan.
So............all hail to the King..........the sexy King Jesus...........oh yea.

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
Once again, you find it easy to pass judgment. If I sound bitter to you, what would you call Jesus when he cursed the pharisees and called them vipers and sons of Satan? Whatever the pharisees might have done, they didn't rape and beat little children in the name of God. There is such a thing as righteous anger, but I seriously doubt you'd know it if it bit you in the ass.

If my tone is angry, it's because I get tired of the kind of sloppy moral reasoning you've expressed. If my tone offends you, think of it as a small reflection on how terribly offensive your obtuse lack of compassion for the Family's victims appears. La-la-la, forgive and forget! Get the victory! Feeling a little hurt, are we? Jeez-ass luvs yah! I love you! Feel better now? NO? There must be something wrong with YOU. (Surely there's nothing wrong with a clueless crackpot who offers insensitive advice in a spirit of profound ignorance.)

I don't hold God responsible for what humans chose to do or not to do. I don't hold God responsible for injustice in the world, either. All of this is our doing, and it is us, human begins, who are responsible to make the world a more just & loving place. That won't happen by pretending evil doesn't exist, didn't happen, or that some of our choices haven't done irreparable damage. Vengeance belongs to God, and until the day I die, I will declare that adults who rape and beat children are guilty of a serious crime against humanity. I will also challenge anyone--regardless of how many dopamine receptors he appears to have fried beyond recovery--who tries to minimize, rationalize, or deny the evil that was done to a generation of children born into the Family International.

Why not get better educated about the lifelong impact of child abuse on the victims before passing judgment on me and offering advice to those who survived that particular holocaust?

Quote:

I'm 36,married,a mother of two,and a former member of the Family.I got out when I was 14.I have tried to make a normal life for myself but it's been hard.I still have nightmares about the past.There were 7 kids in my immediate family(I am the oldest)and most of them have problems directly related to their upbringing and time spent in the Family.The abuse has haunted and changed us all.I don't even tell people about it because it so wierd. As an adult and a mother,I have a difficult time understanding that serving God required such horrible sacrifices.I want to forgive and move on with my life.But the past just won't go away.It is amazing that I even believe in God.My mother is still very involved with the Family and refuses to see how destructive it has been to all of her children.My reaction over the years has been to distance myself from everything even remotely related to the Family.What happened to Ricky was heartbreaking.One of my brothers just passed away and it looks like suicide,another brother is on heavy medication and is severely depressed from his experiences in the Family,my sister had a nervous breakdown two years ago.So,I feel like I just can't get away from the past.I have a great husband and my daughter(19)just had a baby.My son (16)is deaf and has special needs and he is my inspiration.I have alot to be thankful for and yet I'm sad and scared often.I worry too much and I suffer over MY family.I have looked for a support group but its hard to talk about with people that haven't been there.I was in the Family from age 2 to 14.And it has overshadowed my life in the worst way.Any helpful advice?

Posted by workerbee at http://www.exfamily.org/chatbbs/genx/index.html

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
Your welcome to your hatred.. as I should be welcome with my optimistic attitude of the family. I am sorry to hear of your siblings becoming so disturbed.
It is very difficult when you leave such a family and expect to find comfort out in the world that is so evil and self centered.
The easy way would have been to stay in the family and change it from the inside, as it seems many YA have done. Once out there? per say. The world takes over and all things simple become an evil to be fought.
Like a no win situation, I cannot accept your hatred of the family and wont, ohh and my neurons and network of synapse receptors are working fine.. thank you.
I have studded physiology, quantum sciences and lots of other stuff... Years of a lonely life does that to you. My choice.
So stay biter against THEM, the sexual abusers, the world will pat you on the back. Your right in some was your wrong in some ways.
You should know CHANGE comes from within not from outside. Or you can go with the philosophy of destroy the tree, if thats the case, why stop there,
Christianity is next...
1. its easy for me. I was on the road 90% of the time.
2. I am not you, and never had a chance to work from within.
3. I have my Jesus and I really care not... ahahaha

all hail to Jesus.............

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?

zflash7 wrote:

wow, ur a bitter piece of work. Try crucifixion before you get on your high horse and tell of the crimes of this world.
Your entitled to curse out the Family, if you wish. Hey why not blame God for creating satan in the first place., the buck has got to stop somewhere?
Life is a struggle and my experiences were anything but Joyful...of which I will not elaborate on.
So apart from the sex... what else is wrong with the Family? They try hard to serve Jesus in His great mission. To you the religious system is correct hey?
Like I said your entitled to your hatred, you are not alone so many hate these people.
But me I love anyone who in sincerity wishes to serve Jesus and not the System/Satan.
So............all hail to the King..........the sexy King Jesus...........oh yea.

This guy is absolutely mental... Don't you understand? I'm sick and tired of this God-family--jesus-dad-blah-blah-blah bullshit - I wish we had this conversation face to face, so that I could stick your Bible and your Pedo-prophets up your ASS! So many people in the fucking Family got hurt, including me, and you're fucking telling me how to react to this and how to feel? Fuck you! Take your religious bullshit to hell with you - because that's where you're gonna spend your miserable eternity, you, sick fuck! Your feeble philosophy stinks, you know. Don't see any reason to explain things to you - enough has been written on that topic, but you will never see, because you don't want to see the truth - you only want to sing and to enjoy in your hedonistic religion. Don't you tell us about "hatred" - we've seen too much of it in the F.!!! Who the fuck r u telling to try crucifixion? Who do you think you are? Your pride and arrogance stink, really. Maybe you should try fucking crucifixion, before telling people what to do? ha? Why are you here? Ha, you probably think of yourself as if you were a hero on a white horse, telling God's word to us, bitter infidels? You're simply being a ridiculous clown... Go and get yourself crucified, moron - help the planet. And who the fuck told you that their "criminal child sex abuse past" is over? It will never be over. Never!NEVER! This will never be forgotten - not in this world, nor in the "heavenly future". And you know what? I do blame your "sexy god" and I do hate - this is solely my prerogative. Let's hear your feeble talk about "love" when I will fuck you in the ass with a broomstick - only then will you have the right to speak up about god's love and forgiveness! Don't you fucking dare to tell us about our abused kids and what our reactions to this should be like, you, stupid fuck! I really do not see the point to reason with you - get mental help...

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
your anger will only destroy you.
You think your doing God a service..........YOUR NOT...JC.

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?

zflash7 wrote:

your anger will only destroy you.
You think your doing God a service..........YOUR NOT...JC.

My anger against perverts and pedophiles like Berg and miserable religious fanatics like yourself is the only healthy reaction a sane human being can have. My anger will only strengthen me (I do believe we have a very different "religious believes" indeed and (newsflash!) I am not that anxious to "share" them with anyone). And trust me, I'm not serving your "god"!))) But people like you walk through life thinking that YOU are doing your "gods" a service, (which most certainly, you're not!) but in reality you're just hurting people with your crazy perverted "beliefs" -that's all. You're just another loudmouth, as arrogant and dishonest as the rest of "family" members (I've seen enough of them). You dare to come here and to preach at ppl who have suffered so much while serving "jesus" in the "family" and you dare to tell us that we should try "crucifixion"? Have you tried it yourself, ha? We know we have been crucified by "god", his "family" and by sick pedophile Berg, and still, you have the arrogance to come here and to preach at us in such a bossy manner? You've got to be kidding!

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
The righteous anger CAN eat you alive. For years and years and years. The so-called Family left off having anything real to do with God or Jesus a long time ago - probably when "Mo"'s mother died. All the God stuff has simply been a skin covering up a totally different animal underneath. The Group supposedly banning child sex in the 80's runs parallel to the Mormons banning polygamy in an attempt to keep them clear of the law.

When you compare the amount of damage done compared to the amount of incidental good in the lives of thousands of people all over the world, a compassionate person cannot avoid feeling and expressing anger.

I just met a guy I knew 35 years ago when it was still the COG. On the drive to meet him, I was excited to hear of the positive things that could have happened in his life since then. When waiting for our dinner order to arrive, I felt my face go pale and I struggled to not panic when he mentioned that he was now in Mexico - with the Family International.

It really tears my heart up to think of him in there all these years, and the unlikely prospect that he'll ever again get to experience the liberation of life outside the mental and physical grips of the Group. I have his email and will try at least for awhile to communicate with him. It reminded me of that Viet Nam vet in "The Deer Hunter" who lost his mind and was making a living playing roulette - his old friend went back and found him in time to watch him blow his brains out.

If you have an understanding of what the "Family" really is, you'll know that it's nothing about the entity most people think of when you say "God". Just like al Qaeda is not about Islam the religion, or Glenn Beck the religion of Christianity.

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
I don't think refusing to label someone an enemy makes someone unwelcome. Besides, I think for the most part, while people are very wary of TFI in general, my guess is what they primarily consider to be their 'enemy' are specific individuals within the religion who they believe to have committed moral offenses and/or criminal acts, possibly extending to those they believe to be aware of the full extent of them and condone, pardon or cover them up.

I know I certainly feel too ignorant about all the matters to make any conclusions either way, so will continue studying them. Many people who are ex-members have first-hand experiences and are more familiar with various evidences of wrongdoing which is why they would have a more firm opinion about various issues many of us without those memories would be unfamiliar with.

zflash7 wrote:

your anger will only destroy you. You think your doing God a service..........YOUR NOT

Based on the latter sentence I would have expected the former to be "You're anger will only destroy you". =)

Alice wrote:

pedophiles like Berg

I might label the guy a molester or rapist (in either legal or moral sense depending on which story) if some of the accounts I've read about what he's done are accurate, but due to the other stories involving homosexuality not to mention that strange thing he wrote about sex with his grandmother, I'm not sure I would label him as a guy who prefers prepubescents, it seems more like he's sexually attracted to almost anything depending on the moment. With all the escapades with other adults, it's possible that the statutory rape and/or child abuse allegated could be examples of a circumstantial offender abusing power easily as opposed to an example of a paraphilic preference.

Re: Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?
The anger is not related to specific physical acts so much as it is the fact that most people that got involved with the group did it for all the right reasons. And the "leadership" took advantage of that vulnerability and used it for their own self gratification. It was a spiritual rape. Not unlike the Manson "family". The physical acts are a manifestation of what's happening spiritually/psychologically. I don't know if there's a specific word for that type of an abuser, but there should be. At the root of it there is narcissism, among other things. It's not caring for others - it's only really about feeding your own psyche that's taking you for a ride. Not every thought that passes through your head belongs to you, and that doesn't mean it came from God either. Some people never learn to just let those types of thoughts pass through and avoid attachment to them or take ownership of them. Mindfulness meditation can help develop a more healthy mental state and retrain your brain to function in reality, letting go of the past and not living in the future. Here and now is the only reality. "The Zen of Recovery" is a good read.

I suppose it depends on how hardline the editors of the forum are. Having not been directly involved with the COG since they threw me out in 1971, I can't say much about The Family, except for what my old pastor told me, that he is concerned about their unwillingness to publicly repudiate the bad stuff, but if I held everybody to that strict standard I would cease talking to anyone. As it is, I keep touch with anyone who will talk to me, even the ones who insult my beliefs in the most dastardly manner. Maybe something I tell them will help them to lose interest in the COG, Family, Marxism, Atheism, Pastafarianism, etc.

You: I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?

Me: It says xFamily. You have extremely low logic for asking that question. xFamily means no retarded family cult which means we do not like people who are in it or who supports it. You must be a low life 13 year old hitting puberty.

GTFO riding Bergs spiritual cock. Do it somewhere else. Thanks.

You: I guess the song.. if you were ever a member."what would Jesus do" comes to mind.

Me: There is no JESUS. There is only a made up story of him. Keep riding that spiritual cock.

xFamily

Q. I am not an enemy to the Family, am I unwelcome here?

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