Does a+b=c?

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Krumple
 
Reply Tue 8 Jun, 2010 02:48 pm
@mark noble,
mark noble;174794 wrote:
Hi Krumple,
I know the values of a,b+c. I have encountered this before.
All you are saying is, for instance > miles and feet = measurements <> measurements = miles and feet.
There's nothing hidden from the obvious.
We can end this right now and I can furnish you with the values of a, b+c, if you want, just ask, but say "please".


You are applying the concepts incorrectly and that is why you failed.

c in my argument is not assumed. But you want to assume and give c a value. You can't do that and make the statement true. The only thing the statement says is that c is equal to the value of the sum of a plus b. If you read it any other way then you are breaking the rules of math.
 
fast
 
Reply Tue 8 Jun, 2010 03:08 pm
@mark noble,
[QUOTE=mark noble;174789]I wasn't including you in that gesture.[/QUOTE]But you said "each of you."

[QUOTE]C) I don't care that you don't like me.[/QUOTE]You may not care either way, but for the record, I don't dislike you.

May your day be as pleasant as mine.
 
Owen phil
 
Reply Tue 8 Jun, 2010 03:40 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple;174810 wrote:
You are applying the concepts incorrectly and that is why you failed.

c in my argument is not assumed. But you want to assume and give c a value. You can't do that and make the statement true. The only thing the statement says is that c is equal to the value of the sum of a plus b. If you read it any other way then you are breaking the rules of math.


Why do you believe that c = (a+b) is different from (a+b)=c ?
What rules of math are you talking about?

(x=y iff y=x, for all x and all y) is a theorem.
 
Krumple
 
Reply Tue 8 Jun, 2010 03:59 pm
@Owen phil,
Owen;174827 wrote:
Why do you believe that c = (a+b) is different from (a+b)=c ?
What rules of math are you talking about?

(x=y iff y=x, for all x and all y) is a theorem.


I'm not in conflict with that. I was in conflict with him stating that C could be assumed which it can't or in most cases you shouldn't assume the value of c otherwise you are likely to make the statement false.
 
Owen phil
 
Reply Tue 8 Jun, 2010 04:05 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple;174833 wrote:
I'm not in conflict with that. I was in conflict with him stating that C could be assumed which it can't or in most cases you shouldn't assume the value of c otherwise you are likely to make the statement false.


What is false, or true, about 3=(a+b) ?
 
Krumple
 
Reply Tue 8 Jun, 2010 04:07 pm
@Owen phil,
Owen;174838 wrote:
What is false, or true, about 3=(a+b) ?


nothing, but that is not the example that he gave which is what I was referring to.
 
William
 
Reply Tue 8 Jun, 2010 05:30 pm
@jack phil,
a + b = a + b.

William
 
mark noble
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 07:44 am
@William,
Krumple;174810 wrote:
You are applying the concepts incorrectly and that is why you failed.

c in my argument is not assumed. But you want to assume and give c a value. You can't do that and make the statement true. The only thing the statement says is that c is equal to the value of the sum of a plus b. If you read it any other way then you are breaking the rules of math.


Hi Krumple,
c has a value, it = a+b
Have a great day.
Mark...

fast;174819 wrote:
But you said "each of you."

You may not care either way, but for the record, I don't dislike you.

May your day be as pleasant as mine.


Hi Fast,
I have ammended my gesture to disclude you.
I hereby, on this day 09.06.2010, at 1434hrs do declare that each and any future reference to any and all gestures, of any positively intended nature are, by mutual consent, to include every living creature on this, or any other, planet in this, or any other, universe in any measurable realm or dimension, at any given time, with the sole exception of said requestee - "Fast".
And I didn't say that you disliked me, only that you don't like me.

I don't dislike you either, for the record. Why would I?
Mark...
 
Owen phil
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 08:12 am
@mark noble,
mark noble;175015 wrote:
Hi Krumple,
c has a value, it = a+b
Have a great day.
Mark...


Wrong. (a+b) is not a value at all.
(a+b) is a value if and only if a and b are specified.
Then and only then can we calculate the value of c.
 
fast
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 08:15 am
@jack phil,
a + b = c is an equation, and it's an equation with variables, and though we know what the variables are (a, b, and c), we do not know the value of those variables. Yes, we can manipulate the variables and arrive at equivalent equations, but doing so doesn't tell us the value of the variables. In fact, they may not even have a value at all. For example, if we haven't been given the data, or if we haven't collected the data, then the value of the variables are unknown to us.

By the way, "I don't like you" is ambiguous between ~L and L~, so if you say I don't like you, it's not at all clear what you mean. I just wanted to make it clear that the latter wasn't true. That's not to say the first is, of course.

May you bring blessings to those that cross your path,



PS. Why do you put an ellipses after signing your posts?

Hi Mark,
 
Emil
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 09:25 am
@jack phil,
Woo, Fast is getting more analytic! Succes! Anyway, you can use the word "dislike" to mean L~, even though that word is itself ambiguous too (I don't use it ambiguously though and many people are like me in this regard). The chosen symbolism is not particularly good, as ~ is a sign of negation. What does it mean to say that you like the negation of someone? I get what you mean though. In this case a better symbolism would be ~L(x) and D(x), respectively.
 
mark noble
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 09:31 am
@Owen phil,
Owen;175021 wrote:
Wrong. (a+b) is not a value at all.
(a+b) is a value if and only if a and b are specified.
Then and only then can we calculate the value of c.


Hi Owen,
I was asked the question - "Does a+b=c" I answered "yes" to this because, in my eyes, a+b=c. I am not wrong, I am right. Nobody knows the formula I used to reach my conclusion, so you can't say I am wrong.
I am not saying that you are wrong either, because I don't know what formula you used to reach your conclusion. Why does everyone instinctively assume this to be a mathematical question? Why do you think the thread opener (Jack) is merely sitting back and letting us get on with it? I know. Am I wrong on this matter too?

Anyway, have a great day, Owen. And thank you.
Mark...
 
Owen phil
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 09:56 am
@mark noble,
mark noble;175043 wrote:
Hi Owen,
I was asked the question - "Does a+b=c" I answered "yes" to this because, in my eyes, a+b=c. I am not wrong, I am right. Nobody knows the formula I used to reach my conclusion, so you can't say I am wrong.
I am not saying that you are wrong either, because I don't know what formula you used to reach your conclusion. Why does everyone instinctively assume this to be a mathematical question? Why do you think the thread opener (Jack) is merely sitting back and letting us get on with it? I know. Am I wrong on this matter too?

Anyway, have a great day, Owen. And thank you.
Mark...


Clearly, "Does (a+b)=c ?" is not a sensible question, until and unless we know what (a,b,c) refer to. It's like saying: x>y, is true. ???

If you believe that (a+b)=c is true, how about (a+b)=d, is that true too???

We assume that (a+b_=c) is a mathematical question, because of the + and =. What things, other than numbers, could (a, b, c) be?

"Why do you think the thread opener (Jack) is merely sitting back and letting us get on with it? I know. Am I wrong on this matter too?"

What is it that you claim to know here?
I have not yet learned to read minds, have you?

Both you and Jack fail to understand the function of variables and constants in logic or mathematics.
 
mark noble
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 09:56 am
@fast,
fast;175022 wrote:
a + b = c is an equation, and it's an equation with variables, and though we know what the variables are (a, b, and c), we do not know the value of those variables. Yes, we can manipulate the variables and arrive at equivalent equations, but doing so doesn't tell us the value of the variables. In fact, they may not even have a value at all. For example, if we haven't been given the data, or if we haven't collected the data, then the value of the variables are unknown to us.

By the way, "I don't like you" is ambiguous between ~L and L~, so if you say I don't like you, it's not at all clear what you mean. I just wanted to make it clear that the latter wasn't true. That's not to say the first is, of course.

May you bring blessings to those that cross your path,



PS. Why do you put an ellipses after signing your posts?

Hi Mark,


Hi Fast,
If there are no values then, what must the values be?

Why are you using an archaic text style?
What does this mean "~L and L~"? It's just capital l's with eyebrows to me.
Why are you so fussed about me wishing you well, but have no qualms in doing so to me?
When I say I don't dislike you, Fast, it is because I Don't dislike anyone.
I find you quite likeable actually.

Ellipses? Do you know morse code?

Why do you say hello at the end of your post? Are you upside-down?

Mark...
 
Huxley
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 10:02 am
@mark noble,
mark noble;175043 wrote:
Hi Owen,
I was asked the question - "Does a+b=c" I answered "yes" to this because, in my eyes, a+b=c. I am not wrong, I am right. Nobody knows the formula I used to reach my conclusion, so you can't say I am wrong.
I am not saying that you are wrong either, because I don't know what formula you used to reach your conclusion. Why does everyone instinctively assume this to be a mathematical question?


Well, by convention, these symbols represent mathematical expressions. These letters are usually reserved for specific but unknown constants. So.... I suppose I'm appealing to convention in so answering in a mathematical manner.

Quote:

Why do you think the thread opener (Jack) is merely sitting back and letting us get on with it? I know. Am I wrong on this matter too?



How are you interpreting the question?
 
mark noble
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 10:11 am
@Owen phil,
Owen;175054 wrote:
Clearly, "Does (a+b)=c ?" is not a sensible question, until and unless we know what (a,b,c) refer to. It's like saying: x>y, is true. ???

If you believe that (a+b)=c is true, how about (a+b)=d, is that true too???

We assume that (a+b_=c) is a mathematical question, because of the + and =. What things, other than numbers, could (a, b, c) be?

"Why do you think the thread opener (Jack) is merely sitting back and letting us get on with it? I know. Am I wrong on this matter too?"

What is it that you claim to know here?
I have not yet learned to read minds, have you?

Both you and Jack fail to understand the function of variables and constants in logic or mathematics.


Hi Owen,
1) They are letters of the alphabet, not just the english alphabet either.
2) I know that Jack is sitting back and letting us all get on with it - What can be gathered by this?
Yes I can read minds. I know that you are of the type that will not be able to resist the temptation to submit another post on this thread.
3) Just because I am not conversing in a logical or mathematical manner, doesn't mean I don't understand them. How can you assume this of Jack and I, can you read minds?

Anyway, have a great day, Owen. And thank you.
Mark...

---------- Post added 06-09-2010 at 05:12 PM ----------

Huxley;175058 wrote:

How are you interpreting the question?


Hi Huxley,
By convention? This is not a conventional question.

What do you mean exactly?
Journey well sir.
Mark...
 
The Joker006
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 10:24 am
@mark noble,
A B & C simply cancel out eachother. This equation has no absolute relevence to itself. Lets face it characters added to equal another character makes no sense. The physical form of a and b does not form c?? a+b = ab. Simple?
 
Huxley
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 10:42 am
@mark noble,
mark noble;175060 wrote:

Hi Huxley,
By convention? This is not a conventional question.

What do you mean exactly?
Journey well sir.
Mark...


The question itself is not conventional, but the interpretation I am employing is a conventional interpretation of the symbols used.
 
mark noble
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 10:46 am
@The Joker006,
The Joker006 wrote:
A B & C simply cancel out eachother. This equation has no absolute relevence to itself. Lets face it characters added to equal another character makes no sense. The physical form of a and b does not form c?? a+b = ab. Simple?


Hi,
I am so glad to have you as a friend, you've made my sides split.
Thank you, my friend, indeed.
Mark...
 
The Joker006
 
Reply Wed 9 Jun, 2010 11:07 am
@mark noble,
Thank you Mark, you know it is nice to have a friend like you who appreciates Philosophy. The courtesy is extended to Mark Gamson too.

Have a good one.
 
 

 
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